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podcasting 2.0 for December
24 2021, episode 67 Satoshi

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stocking stuffer everybody there
you go. The last meeting of the

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Board of Directors I think is
the last one we're almost at the

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end of the year just before
Christmas time to figure out

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what's going on and what has
been going on and podcast

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index.org with the podcast
namespace and of course, the

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lovely community at podcast
index dot social I'm Adam curry

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here in the heart of Texas Texas
Hill Country and in Alabama. The

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man who actually knows who's
been naughty or nice my friend

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on the other end ladies and
gentlemen, please say hello to

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Mr. Dave Jones.

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There's no good numerology for
episode 6767 is the most boring

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number it's that's always like
the white guy on the basketball

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team.

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He's number six

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Yeah, I think he's always 67
It's weird. You get I'm all over

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the place here that it's like
it's not a typical board meeting

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because it's not actually Friday
The Night Before Christmas.

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This is started the show upside
down. Well, we did.

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We did. Although luckily we have
the typical hokey radio guy

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sound effects for a for a
Christmas episode. And we're

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doing this today with our guest
in Australia. Mr. James Cridland

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greetings strike it's beyond I
I'm a big fan of the sleigh

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bells.

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Oh well good because I also if
James was can you just sit in

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the corner here in this once you
get the the Chesterfield? There.

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You got that one? Because that's
a little closer to the fire

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here. Oh, yeah. Yes. Nice.

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Oh, all we need now is a phone
in with Santa.

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Oh, exactly. Yes, that's right.
I see. James is an old radio

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dude like myself. So I know he
appreciates these kinds of hokey

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things.

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Yeah, I've just got to find an
old radio dude. Like yourself.

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Did they? Did they have in the
UK? Did they have the? We're

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tracking Santa on radar is one
and already have that NORAD?

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Yeah, there was there was a time
when I think the RAF was doing

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something and yeah, right.
Everybody found Google and they

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found no right. And what does
NORAD stand for? The

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Russians? Russia defense? Yeah,
yeah. No. So

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we do we yeah, we didn't do any
of that. And of course, of

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course, here in Australia, it's,
you know, it's, I mean,

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obviously, already now. It's
tomorrow. Yeah. And that's

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why we're pre taping this
because we realize that there's

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no way we can we can do it on
Friday at our regular time, it

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would be practically new years
where you are so yeah, how old

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are those jokes get after? Why
are you so tired of them? We

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just put up with them from
people making the fucking

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timezone joke.

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Oh, yeah. And then this the then
this the upside down joke,

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which Dave started with Dave
started that. Yeah, that was

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the only Australian joke I know.
Now I've got another one. It's

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the everything can kill you
joke. I mean, this,

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which is absolutely true, which
is very true. Oh, my goodness. I

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have a question though. Before
we get into what we're going to

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do at the board meeting today, I
lived in Los Angeles for better

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living in San Francisco. And I
had business in London, in the

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Netherlands and in the United
States. And it was so different

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from anything I've ever
experienced as it comes to

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timing. So you're working there.
Some people are three hours

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later than you some are up to
nine hours later, I've had the

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reverse where I was in London
and was dealing with San

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Francisco. How does that affect
your life? With what you do

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getting a newsletter out daily
producing, you know, the daily,

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the daily podcast? I mean, does
it fit in perfectly with a

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normal schedule? Do you feel
like you're living in two

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different worlds? One is the
kind of the the civilized

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Western, sorry, kind of the
West, you know where we are?

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What Where's Yeah, where the
innovation and business and

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excitement is? And then you I
can't help myself, I think but

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you know what I'm saying?

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I think you'll find the
innovation and excitement is

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here. We invented Wi Fi so

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this was not parrot systems was
not the company it

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was. It was an Australian
company. Invented Wi Fi today.

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There you go. Quick, quick.
Wikipedia check. I remember I

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invented Google Maps. So yeah,
so if you're if you're a fan of

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Google Maps, then that's also
why I'm saying we

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keyhole came from Australia.

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Yeah, they they're the Google
Maps came from Yeah, it was it

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was a Sydney thing.

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Really. So just a bunch of
spooks there. Man, that whole

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keyhole thing was a CIA
operation. You guys did five

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eyes

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doesn't mean, five.

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But yes, no, where were you
going? Oh, yes. So, time zones

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and things. It's really good if
you're writing a newsletter,

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like the pod news newsletter,
which is free pot news,

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donations, right? It's really,
really good. Because it means

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that nine o'clock at night, my
time is six in the morning, the

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same day New York time. So that
means that I've got all day to

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write something that you lot
will will wake up to. Okay, so

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that's really nice. Yeah, so
that is really, really helpful.

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What it's not helpful for is
trying to talk to anybody.

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Because obviously, every
everybody is either asleep, or

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they're, you know, come on, you
know, I finished my working day.

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So that that gets very, very
hard, which is why, you know, I

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used to try and always go to,
you know, Podcast Movement, and,

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you know, pod fest, and all of
these other big podcast

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conferences, so that I could
actually talk to people and, you

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know, and meet people and
everything else, because

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otherwise, I could never do that
in recent times. And so, as you

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can imagine, the last two years
have been fun.

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And just from living your life,
day to day in, in Brisbane, and

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then made you feel like you're
behind what's happening, or that

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you actually are ahead of what's
happening. If you know what I

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mean, just the new cycles of
products. Yeah,

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the news cycle really confused
me when I first moved here,

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because essentially, there's
stuff that goes on during the

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day, which is all Australian,
because you are all asleep. And

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then everything happens
overnight. So you know, Europe

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wakes up and does its thing, the
US wakes up and does its thing.

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So by the next morning,
basically, it's a big dump of

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everything that happened
overnight. And certainly for the

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last, you know, for the last
four years in your country,

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there was an awful lot happening
every single day. And so, so

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just sort of waking up to that
blizzard of news about what's

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going on in Europe, what's going
on in the US. Every morning was

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just really strange to me
having, you know, obviously,

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growing up in the UK,

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what's the first thing that you
do? I mean, do you do when do

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you start to ingest the
information at what point in

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your in your waking cycle?

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Oh, you know, I mean, I tend not
to listen to too much news

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media. I'll listen to the local
public radio station. But

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it's like when you get when you
when you put your feet on the

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ground out of bed? Or do you
look at your phone first? You

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know, do you have breakfast
first?

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Oh, so normally normally it's
the Google speaker is waking me

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up to some to some radio.

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Time to wake up it's hard to
wake up this is your overlord

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from Google?

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Well, actually, I've got her
saying she says good morning to

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us and including the dog which
is always important. And then

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she tells us what the
temperature is going to be like

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you're living in a sci fi movie
aren't you? Ours is great.

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And she tells us what we've got
in our diaries and and then she

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starts playing it used to be
that she would wake us up to the

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the ABC News for here and then
the BBC News from back home. But

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that was that was insane. So I
stopped I stopped ending up

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doing wow so

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like you had a great it looks
like you had a great night's

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sleep last night you know much
less than

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your heart rate was lower than
normal. You had good resting

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sleep you are ready I love human
resource you are fit for the day

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human resource.

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One of the one of the devices
that I have does actually

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monitor you at while you're
while you're in bed asleep from

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Google as you can and you can
guess that I've not allowed that

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to happen.

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Your your partner's very smart
person. Yes. Very, very smart

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person not having that.

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James is looking for I'm looking
for. There's this. We have these

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printers at a job I had, like 25
years ago, humongous laser

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printers. And it was a company
called Anzac. Oh, yeah. And I'm

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thinking that they may have
helped develop the laser pre

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Australian company. And I'm
thinking they may have actually

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helped develop the first laser
printer. These things are

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ancient and yeah. So we, we had
this I worked one of my first

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gigs was doing sis ops for sort
of a for a big insurance

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company. And then we had as for
hundreds connected to the Yeah,

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connected to the as 400 words.
Were a bunch of ANZAC laser

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printers. And then also a bunch
of those humongous green and

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white striped tractor feed
printers. Not not Small ones,

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you know, but the ones that are
like, What 20 inches wide, the

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paper was. So you would, and
nobody, nobody younger than, you

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know, 40 understands it didn't
see anything like this, you, you

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have this huge thing. I mean,
there's big as you know, a

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person he lit in, you take like
a 2000 reams stack of pages off

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of this thing, and it has the
tractor feed on the side. But

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the but the tractor feed is not
like perforated. It's, it's just

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solid, it's a solid shadow, you
don't you don't tear it off. So

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you had to take it over to this
machine called a burster. And

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the burster would cut the
tractor feed off the side off of

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both sides of this thing. And it
was basically this huge thing

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about the size of sounds like a
guillotine. It was like half the

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size of a pool table. And you
stick you stick your stack of

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tractor feed your huge thing of
tractor feature, you load the

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first thing in, you know, and
it's going to suck this page in

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at like it's going to pull the
whole stack through and cut it

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off. And so there's these huge
blades on the left and the

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right, that look like pizza
cutters. And then so you lined

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it up, and you start, he starts
the thing rolling in, it goes

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real slow. And then you let you
make sure everything's situated

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and everything's going right and
it's running around, you know, I

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don't know, one mile an hour,
it's going like one mile an

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hour, and then you so then you
slowly raise the speed and you

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get it going faster and faster
and faster. And the fun thing

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about it was that you would get
to the certain point. And it was

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the happy zone. And so then it's
it's chugging along, but new

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people, they would always cut it
they would start to feel a

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little too comfortable. And they
cut it up too high. They go like

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one mile an hour to how and this
thing. And it was start flying.

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And then it would just go slow
and paper everywhere. I mean,

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just fly you know all over the
place. And you would It would

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ruin every all 2000 pages this
thing in so fast, you couldn't

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even blink. So you'd have to
pull print the whole thing out

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again.

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And that was what 20 years ago,
maybe

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3020 24 years ago, something
like that. Did 2425 years ago,

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IBM as 400 was my client, we
built their website. Really?

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Yeah. And guess guess what they
insisted. But that it run on an

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eight that the website run on an
A S 400.

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Oh my god. Oh, wow. Good luck
with that.

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That was hilarious. I think we
ultimately said Look, you guys

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bought Lotus Notes. Why don't we
just do that? Okay, it's just

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much easier. It's one of your
products. GE Yes. Wow, way.

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Gosh. So James, before we get
into all of the year, which is

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why I think we know at least
this is what Dave sold to me.

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Yeah, we're gonna do a look back
at No, he said to be specific.

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James will do a look back at the
year for us. Yeah, yeah. Right.

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And I asked Dave, do I need to
do any prep? And Dave said, Nah,

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no, no,

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we'll just wing it. Exactly. I
think congratulations are in

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order. I know you are an advisor
to captivate. I heard you say

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this morning that you were an
advisor. I was but did you have

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anything to do with the deal?
Because it sure feels like it.

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I wasn't advisor until the the
exact time that the deal went

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through.

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Congratulations. Excellent. So
beers on James Nice.

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So Captivate has been bought by
a global, which is Europe's

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largest Radio Group. But it also
runs DAX, which is a ad

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insertion service in the US and
also, by the way, runs the the

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big poster sites in the tube in
London, and, you know, on the

224
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side of streets and things like
that they basically run those,

225
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what do you mean, they're run a
little company? Where they they

226
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own them? So I know, okay, the
big poster, what

227
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was it? What was the they
decided to go ahead?

228
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They decided one year to to get
into outdoor advertising. And so

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they bought the number one
outdoor company and then they

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bought the number two outdoor
company as well. Wow, just you

231
00:14:18,900 --> 00:14:20,730
know, because because, you know,
why not? You're

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not allowed to do that in
America. In America, we put a

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stop to that. Competitive Hey,
what do you think was a creative

234
00:14:28,530 --> 00:14:33,150
to them for the purchase?
Captivate what was what how does

235
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it fit in their overall
strategy,

236
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but I think it fits into their
overall strategy because, you

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know, global at the moment are
you know, they're very good at

238
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getting, you know, big names,
big talent, and, you know, and

239
00:14:46,140 --> 00:14:50,010
all that kind of stuff for their
podcasts, but they don't own a

240
00:14:50,010 --> 00:14:55,830
podcast host for themselves. So
if they wanted to emulate what a

241
00:14:55,830 --> 00:14:59,970
caste, for example has been
doing, or to a degree, what has

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Spotify has been doing in
getting in allowing anyone who

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wants to podcast giving them a
platform and selling ads in

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those shows, then that's
something that, you know, global

245
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couldn't do because they didn't
own a podcast host. Now who

246
00:15:16,980 --> 00:15:17,910
wants I think it's inch

247
00:15:17,969 --> 00:15:21,119
who owns DAX, who has the the ad
insertion technology.

248
00:15:21,719 --> 00:15:26,579
So DAX is owned by a bi global
so that that, that that I think,

249
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is the exciting thing that
they've basically gone. Right.

250
00:15:28,949 --> 00:15:32,969
You know, we we want to be in
podcasting properly. You know,

251
00:15:32,969 --> 00:15:36,239
as my, is my understanding, and
you know, and this is going to

252
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be one of the things that they
end up doing, to actually have

253
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their own podcast host. So, you
know, it's interesting when you

254
00:15:43,949 --> 00:15:51,599
have a look at Sirius XM bought
simple cost. I have Omni studio.

255
00:15:52,769 --> 00:15:57,329
Listen still. Oh, is it right?
Yeah. Libsyn is still is still

256
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independent in terms of a large
media company. But you can fit,

257
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you can clearly see that there
are large media companies

258
00:16:04,679 --> 00:16:07,649
basically buying up as many
podcast hosts as they can.

259
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So here's what I'm seeing. I'm
seeing the strategies vary from

260
00:16:12,150 --> 00:16:16,320
company to company, but it looks
like radio has woken up. They're

261
00:16:16,350 --> 00:16:20,430
about 15 years. on the late
side, I would say they've woken

262
00:16:20,430 --> 00:16:23,370
up. They're saying, Okay, we're
not going to take it laying

263
00:16:23,370 --> 00:16:25,830
down. I think it's very similar
to what we're seeing in the

264
00:16:25,830 --> 00:16:30,630
United States with television
news. Fox News started by

265
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creating Fox nation. And CNN is
now starting CNN plus, it's what

266
00:16:37,020 --> 00:16:40,650
the studios have done with the
streamers. So it's so the

267
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tradition, it's really about the
the cost and the art and the

268
00:16:44,310 --> 00:16:48,570
opportunity, I guess, for the
reach that you can achieve with

269
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with podcasts and with online.
It's a trend now it's a trend

270
00:16:55,230 --> 00:16:58,530
radio is striking back now.
Would you say?

271
00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:01,320
I think it's I think it is
absolutely that. But I think it

272
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is also just looking at the
consumption. Radio is very much

273
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an old thing. And so radio is
being propped up by people who

274
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are 45 plus 55. Plus, when you
start having a look at younger

275
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audiences, they are listening to
far more stuff on demand. Right.

276
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So whether that's music on
demand, or whether that's

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speech, talk on demand. Now

278
00:17:23,850 --> 00:17:28,050
a question for you, do you
think? Because this is critical,

279
00:17:28,050 --> 00:17:30,900
this is a point I tried to make
the other day to Todd and Rob.

280
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See, looking at the trend of
young people that trend is on

281
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demand, no advertising, it can
be free. I know I'm giving up my

282
00:17:41,490 --> 00:17:44,970
my left nut for that Google
YouTube, whatever. But the

283
00:17:44,970 --> 00:17:49,050
concept of advertising I feel in
traditional sense. And I'll just

284
00:17:49,050 --> 00:17:53,220
say the interruptive advertising
model. That's not the same as

285
00:17:53,220 --> 00:17:56,880
host reads or annual, many other
forms that that it can and I

286
00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:00,480
hopefully new forms that can
come this is what I hoped was

287
00:18:00,510 --> 00:18:05,850
odd show 20 years ago. Do I see
this to be a danger in the

288
00:18:06,030 --> 00:18:09,870
direction that podcasting is
commercialized? Podcasting is

289
00:18:09,870 --> 00:18:14,130
heading where people are so
focused on the ads, but it's the

290
00:18:14,130 --> 00:18:17,370
need to change the nature of
them. It seems like the audience

291
00:18:17,370 --> 00:18:20,160
is not digging that. And they
just fast forward through the

292
00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:21,210
many way if they can.

293
00:18:22,530 --> 00:18:26,190
Yeah, I think there's some
evidence around people fast

294
00:18:26,190 --> 00:18:29,490
forwarding some people fast
forwarding through ads, although

295
00:18:29,490 --> 00:18:32,880
I think the majority of people
still still don't, but at the

296
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:36,300
end of the day, yeah, you know,
I don't think that radio ads

297
00:18:36,300 --> 00:18:41,730
work very well on podcasts. And,
you know, if all of a sudden I

298
00:18:41,730 --> 00:18:46,380
mean, you know, I was listening
to a, a true crime podcast a

299
00:18:46,380 --> 00:18:49,800
month or so ago, and it was a
beautifully produced podcast,

300
00:18:49,830 --> 00:18:52,050
and you know, the sound
direction was excellent and

301
00:18:52,050 --> 00:18:53,970
blah, blah, blah, and then all
of a sudden, it stopped for an

302
00:18:53,970 --> 00:18:58,320
ad break. And there was this
crazy guy talking about good

303
00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:01,590
buying, you know, whatever it
was, you know, mattress or

304
00:19:01,590 --> 00:19:07,080
something else programmatic.
Just completely, you know,

305
00:19:07,230 --> 00:19:07,560
that's,

306
00:19:08,310 --> 00:19:13,260
that's us, James. We are in the
in the 40 to 50 year old range

307
00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:17,760
is today's millennial and forget
to Zoomers, they have no

308
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,820
interest in listening to ADS,
they just run away from just

309
00:19:20,820 --> 00:19:23,400
saying I think that's a problem.
We need to address that with the

310
00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:25,980
industry. I don't but the
industry needs to address it.

311
00:19:27,270 --> 00:19:29,640
Yeah, I would agree. And I think
you know, we we've certainly

312
00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:33,150
seen an awful lot more, you
know, influencers and, and, you

313
00:19:33,150 --> 00:19:37,380
know, those sorts of ways of
getting closer to a, you know,

314
00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:41,910
getting closer to a brand. And
you know, a 32nd ad or somebody

315
00:19:41,910 --> 00:19:44,670
shouting at you with a funny
voice is not necessarily going

316
00:19:44,670 --> 00:19:46,020
to work too. Well. I don't for

317
00:19:46,050 --> 00:19:49,710
let me let me let me ask you
this though. It so and this is

318
00:19:49,710 --> 00:19:52,170
something I've been confused
about forever. And I've heard

319
00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:55,200
I've heard people try to explain
it but it still doesn't make

320
00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:58,980
sense to me. Is that so you're
talking about they say well

321
00:19:58,980 --> 00:20:02,190
radio is old and It's, you know,
I don't know what the range

322
00:20:02,190 --> 00:20:05,850
would be 45 and up 50 And up.
And those are the people. Those

323
00:20:05,850 --> 00:20:09,510
are the people that have money.
Yeah, you know, the older, the

324
00:20:09,510 --> 00:20:13,320
older the demographic? Yeah,
yeah, the more money they have

325
00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:15,990
young people don't have money.
But that's the ones that

326
00:20:15,990 --> 00:20:19,020
advertisers always want to
target the most. And the way

327
00:20:19,020 --> 00:20:22,470
it's always been explained to me
as well. Because those are the

328
00:20:22,470 --> 00:20:24,300
ones who are the trendsetters.
They're the young

329
00:20:24,390 --> 00:20:28,590
well, okay, but let's, let's
just, let's acknowledge that.

330
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:32,460
There's a lot of money in
traditional media, in radio and

331
00:20:32,460 --> 00:20:37,080
in television, a lot of it is
from pharmaceutical especially

332
00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:41,580
on on cable television, so they
really dominate telcos I think

333
00:20:41,580 --> 00:20:47,130
is is what's really, it's
equally as big. And they target

334
00:20:47,130 --> 00:20:50,700
towards the younger market. And
so that the just that and

335
00:20:50,700 --> 00:20:55,440
insurance, that's for everybody
things that everybody needs. The

336
00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,990
kids get money for that somehow
whether the parents are paying

337
00:20:57,990 --> 00:21:00,420
for it, or they have to steal
it, there's there's always money

338
00:21:00,420 --> 00:21:03,960
for your cell phone, and some
other things. Well, there's

339
00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:10,500
your there's your second leg to
that, then is we we hear that

340
00:21:10,740 --> 00:21:15,570
podcast skews to an older
demographic as well. Or at least

341
00:21:15,570 --> 00:21:18,750
don't know. The stats, is that

342
00:21:19,650 --> 00:21:22,590
it? I don't think it does. I
don't think it does anymore. And

343
00:21:22,590 --> 00:21:25,800
I think actually, when you when
you start looking at younger

344
00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,560
audiences, for example, they are
listening to a lot more spoken

345
00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:32,460
word now than they we have most
of the spoken word there is his

346
00:21:32,460 --> 00:21:34,110
podcasts. And we have a crapload

347
00:21:34,110 --> 00:21:37,500
of millennial producers for no
agenda that just showing up to

348
00:21:37,530 --> 00:21:40,260
their new to new to is like oh,
yeah, no, I was looking for

349
00:21:40,260 --> 00:21:40,950
something else.

350
00:21:41,550 --> 00:21:45,570
Yeah, yeah. So I think no, we're
seeing an awful lot of that. I

351
00:21:45,570 --> 00:21:49,710
mean, you know, Dave, if your
question is that if it's

352
00:21:49,710 --> 00:21:53,340
predominantly 55 Plus listening
to the radio, why don't

353
00:21:53,340 --> 00:21:55,740
advertisers, why aren't
advertisers interested in them?

354
00:21:56,790 --> 00:22:00,420
I think that's a great question.
And and it's a question which,

355
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:03,540
frankly, nobody can really
understand. I think they are.

356
00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:07,740
Well, other than it's, it's the
ad buyers. It's the it's the hot

357
00:22:07,740 --> 00:22:11,100
young things at the ad agencies.
Well, you have no life

358
00:22:11,100 --> 00:22:15,180
experience. And so therefore,
they're literally buying stuff

359
00:22:15,180 --> 00:22:18,810
on the stuff that they consume.
And so they're there. I mean,

360
00:22:18,810 --> 00:22:20,700
you know, there's a great oldest
station here,

361
00:22:21,420 --> 00:22:24,480
by the way, is a very, very
important, very important point

362
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:29,880
you make there, I have long said
that the media buyers, are are

363
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:34,740
just corrupted kids who just
want Lakers tickets, and they'll

364
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:38,130
they'll make the buy on the
stuff that they listen to.

365
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:39,930
You're absolutely right. Yeah,

366
00:22:40,050 --> 00:22:44,100
I remember I was working for
radio station in London. And we

367
00:22:44,130 --> 00:22:48,480
told the market that we had put
up a load of billboard

368
00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:53,070
advertising across London. What
we'd actually done is we'd put

369
00:22:53,070 --> 00:22:58,110
up about four billboard ads in
the street where the advertising

370
00:22:58,110 --> 00:23:01,650
agencies were, because then the
advertising agencies would seize

371
00:23:01,650 --> 00:23:04,290
Yes. Oh, wow. This is this is
really, you know, they've,

372
00:23:04,530 --> 00:23:09,000
they've spent an awful lot. So
the market? Yeah, they blanketed

373
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:12,420
the market. So you know, you
know, the oldest station that I

374
00:23:12,420 --> 00:23:17,220
listened to here, 4k Q You know,
I'm, I've just just turned 50.

375
00:23:17,250 --> 00:23:22,020
And I love the music on it's,
you know, it's it's sort of, you

376
00:23:22,020 --> 00:23:27,000
know, hot music from the 60s and
70s. It's before my time, but I

377
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:30,360
love you know, I love the whole
feel of it. But all of the ads,

378
00:23:30,360 --> 00:23:36,300
the ads are for pain relief.
Yeah. Pest removal for your

379
00:23:36,300 --> 00:23:40,290
house. Yeah. I'm funeral
directors, which of course, you

380
00:23:40,290 --> 00:23:41,580
know, prepay funerals,

381
00:23:41,610 --> 00:23:45,090
I was gonna say, if you're
hearing this, you're not you're

382
00:23:45,090 --> 00:23:46,680
not ready to be our customer
yet.

383
00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:48,990
Brought to you by Pfizer

384
00:23:50,190 --> 00:23:54,270
thinking, you know what on earth
and the worry, I think for many

385
00:23:54,270 --> 00:23:59,460
people in in radio is that their
audiences are literally dying.

386
00:24:00,060 --> 00:24:04,500
You know. So that, that's,
that's the concern. And I think

387
00:24:04,500 --> 00:24:06,870
that's why podcasting is
interesting, because it is

388
00:24:06,870 --> 00:24:10,620
reaching people with, you know,
spoken word content, you know,

389
00:24:10,620 --> 00:24:13,290
music is probably all going to
move in the long term is all

390
00:24:13,290 --> 00:24:15,660
going to move over to
algorithmic services, like

391
00:24:15,660 --> 00:24:18,570
Spotify, like YouTube music,
like, you know, many of the

392
00:24:18,570 --> 00:24:22,470
other things, and spoken word is
something that can't be done in

393
00:24:22,470 --> 00:24:26,580
that way. And that's why you're
seeing Spotify jumping in with

394
00:24:26,580 --> 00:24:30,480
their purchase of wash car last
week, which is a you know, which

395
00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:34,350
is another Australian podcast
host. They bought Washko because

396
00:24:34,350 --> 00:24:38,820
Washko has some clever tricks to
take radio shows and make them

397
00:24:38,820 --> 00:24:42,540
into podcasts and right, and I
was thinking all kinds of other

398
00:24:42,540 --> 00:24:43,050
stuff going

399
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:46,800
thinking about that. So are they
going to be ingesting? Like I

400
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:50,460
Heart Radio programming? You
know, how's that gonna work?

401
00:24:50,460 --> 00:24:52,650
It's gonna be interesting
because eventually someone like

402
00:24:52,650 --> 00:24:55,410
the comedians, people are going
to start saying, you know, I'm a

403
00:24:55,410 --> 00:24:59,970
little tired. It's like, it's
like I specifically opted out.

404
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:04,770
have Spotify for no agenda, they
put it up. I went through the

405
00:25:04,770 --> 00:25:07,230
whole process. I said, take it
down, we didn't give you

406
00:25:07,230 --> 00:25:12,270
permission is back up. You know,
it's on Facebook. I mean, it's

407
00:25:12,270 --> 00:25:14,100
like, at a certain point,
there's gonna be enough people

408
00:25:14,100 --> 00:25:17,340
who are fed up with this crap
and like, it's okay. If you make

409
00:25:17,340 --> 00:25:20,400
it available for people but your
advertising around it to fuck

410
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:23,280
you. It's just it just gets a
little annoying after a while.

411
00:25:23,790 --> 00:25:27,720
Mm hmm. Yeah, no, I, I would
agree with that. I mean, I think

412
00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:31,680
I think, you know, Spotify is
plan with that whole Washko

413
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:35,700
thing is to basically it's a
completely automated system as I

414
00:25:35,700 --> 00:25:39,600
understand it, Sam, Sam dams
using it. Yeah. He sounds smart

415
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:42,330
as the pod lamp. alright with
me. And yeah, and it sounds

416
00:25:42,330 --> 00:25:45,630
really clever that it basically
sits there, it seems to record

417
00:25:45,630 --> 00:25:48,990
the internet stream, chop it up
and make it available as a

418
00:25:48,990 --> 00:25:49,680
podcast, just

419
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:51,900
11 days, all that shit. Yeah.

420
00:25:51,930 --> 00:25:57,870
I mean, weirdly, that was the
thing. My first you know,

421
00:25:58,590 --> 00:26:02,940
investment into podcasting, I
guess was back in January of

422
00:26:02,940 --> 00:26:08,310
2005, when I was busy taking the
breakfast show from the radio

423
00:26:08,310 --> 00:26:11,400
station that I was working at.
And we worked out some

424
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,520
algorithms to, you know, again,
pull that out, it was a music

425
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:16,830
breakfast show as well. So you
can imagine how complicated that

426
00:26:16,830 --> 00:26:20,370
was getting rid of all of the
music. But you know, pulling

427
00:26:20,370 --> 00:26:24,660
that out making that available
as a as a podcast, automatically

428
00:26:24,660 --> 00:26:28,410
within half an hour of it going
out on the air. And that, and

429
00:26:28,410 --> 00:26:31,710
that was great. And it sounds as
if this is basically that, you

430
00:26:31,710 --> 00:26:36,060
know, at scale, although they're
a fully featured podcast host as

431
00:26:36,060 --> 00:26:38,340
well. So they're going to be
moving a ton of, you know,

432
00:26:38,340 --> 00:26:42,000
really good shows over to
megaphone, I would have guessed.

433
00:26:42,780 --> 00:26:46,140
So is that is that thing worked
out? Generally for some, I'm

434
00:26:46,140 --> 00:26:48,990
assuming what's going to happen?
Let me preface what I was about

435
00:26:48,990 --> 00:26:51,510
to say with this. I'm assuming
that was is what's going to

436
00:26:51,510 --> 00:26:56,340
happen with Captivate is that
global is going to buy them and

437
00:26:56,340 --> 00:27:03,390
use their DAX stuff to give them
a programmatic option. Is that

438
00:27:04,470 --> 00:27:04,950
make sense?

439
00:27:04,980 --> 00:27:11,580
Yeah, I mean, I mean, I, they've
been sort of relatively close.

440
00:27:11,580 --> 00:27:12,360
Have the founders

441
00:27:12,360 --> 00:27:16,830
James is still under NDA. He
can't really tell you. Is that

442
00:27:16,830 --> 00:27:20,850
true? I mean, of course it is.
It's okay. Because he knows of

443
00:27:20,850 --> 00:27:23,970
course, he sold the strategy to
them. This is why I'm so happy

444
00:27:23,970 --> 00:27:29,610
for him. Finally, finally, a win
for Grantland. exited actual

445
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:30,300
exit. That's

446
00:27:30,300 --> 00:27:33,150
nice that house renovation costs
a lot of money. But I'm telling

447
00:27:33,150 --> 00:27:34,290
you, man, he exited

448
00:27:34,649 --> 00:27:38,609
that house renovation I tell
you, yes. My goodness. No, I one

449
00:27:38,609 --> 00:27:42,089
of the things that I do want to
do at some point is, is to

450
00:27:42,089 --> 00:27:45,689
finally get rid of this gas.
This gas guzzling car of mine. I

451
00:27:45,689 --> 00:27:49,079
know Dave that you still drive a
car from you know, I think it

452
00:27:49,079 --> 00:27:52,409
was invented on the on the same
year that cars were invented or

453
00:27:52,409 --> 00:27:53,759
trucks renamed in 19.

454
00:27:54,120 --> 00:27:56,520
Henry Ford drove it himself.
Yes.

455
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:00,660
Yeah, exactly. But I'm there.
I'm there thinking, you know,

456
00:28:00,660 --> 00:28:03,630
maybe now's the time to use
those solar panels on my roof

457
00:28:03,630 --> 00:28:07,620
for something for some for some
automotive excitement as well.

458
00:28:07,649 --> 00:28:09,659
Do you have you have it hooked
up? Do you have the transfer

459
00:28:09,659 --> 00:28:13,139
switch? So you can so you can
actually charge an Eevee

460
00:28:13,139 --> 00:28:13,829
directly?

461
00:28:14,639 --> 00:28:18,509
Well, I don't I don't have an
Eevee yet. But my plan is to

462
00:28:18,929 --> 00:28:21,989
there's a friend of mine who
actually works for Omni studio

463
00:28:21,989 --> 00:28:26,639
and he has used your like this
Adam, he has worked out. He's

464
00:28:26,639 --> 00:28:30,959
using the API from his solar
panels to work out exactly how

465
00:28:30,959 --> 00:28:35,039
much power is being generated.
And he's also worked out the API

466
00:28:35,039 --> 00:28:39,449
for his Tesla so that he can
actually tell his Tesla exactly

467
00:28:39,449 --> 00:28:43,199
how much power to pull from the
solar panels are cool so he's

468
00:28:43,199 --> 00:28:48,329
basically got it so that it's
98% Yeah, 98% efficiency he

469
00:28:48,330 --> 00:28:52,020
needs it. So he needs an extra
Yeah, is he needs a little

470
00:28:52,020 --> 00:28:56,100
headroom like 5% to operate the
the pump for the sprinkler when

471
00:28:56,100 --> 00:28:58,890
the battery explodes. So Oh,
yes,

472
00:28:59,189 --> 00:29:04,379
spring water doesn't matter.
Just prayer is prayer at that

473
00:29:04,379 --> 00:29:04,589
point.

474
00:29:04,620 --> 00:29:09,930
So James, I would say that in
this past year, what I saw with

475
00:29:10,110 --> 00:29:14,490
with podcasting 2.0 And you and
thank and I am forever grateful

476
00:29:14,490 --> 00:29:17,520
how you've covered podcasting
2.0 Pretty much as the lone

477
00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,850
voice in the media in the
beginning you stuck with it and

478
00:29:20,850 --> 00:29:26,430
you have you have endured my
personality and and and you know

479
00:29:28,380 --> 00:29:31,710
just differences in general but
but I know that we respect and

480
00:29:31,710 --> 00:29:35,340
like each other you know in so
many different ways but at a

481
00:29:35,340 --> 00:29:39,300
certain point you went kind of
from you it feels like it took

482
00:29:39,300 --> 00:29:43,410
the red pill it started with you
know okay listen that's great

483
00:29:43,410 --> 00:29:46,290
this funny money I'm
paraphrasing this funny money

484
00:29:46,290 --> 00:29:49,260
but that's okay we did that we
got out of the shit to do was

485
00:29:49,260 --> 00:29:53,970
the message that I recall, too.
I can boost the Graham corner on

486
00:29:54,630 --> 00:29:58,500
your podcast. Was there a moment
when when it when it clicked and

487
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,800
it all came together? For you,
they're like, oh, okay, I can

488
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:06,480
see, first of all, how not just
how to use it, but you know

489
00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:08,910
what, what, what should we can
come up with? Right? You're

490
00:30:08,910 --> 00:30:11,580
inventive. You're, you're
Tinker, you like doing stuff. So

491
00:30:11,580 --> 00:30:14,640
you know what new things we can
do with it. And also the

492
00:30:14,730 --> 00:30:18,750
basically that there's validity
to the value transfer system,

493
00:30:18,750 --> 00:30:22,080
because unless I'm
mischaracterizing how you feel

494
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:22,740
about it now.

495
00:30:23,700 --> 00:30:28,890
Yeah, I mean, I ate took me a
long time to get into the whole

496
00:30:28,890 --> 00:30:34,920
idea of cryptocurrency. And to
just get my head around it. And

497
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:38,430
I'm sure that that is the same
way as many people, I know that

498
00:30:38,430 --> 00:30:41,790
there are many sort of, you
know, doubters out there who are

499
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:47,490
not completely sold on this on
this whole idea so far. But from

500
00:30:47,490 --> 00:30:51,360
a point of view of the whole
value for value thing, I was

501
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:54,090
listening to you on the mere
mortals podcast a couple of

502
00:30:54,090 --> 00:30:58,770
weeks ago. And yeah, and you
know, just just going through,

503
00:31:00,060 --> 00:31:04,980
you know, the whole ethos behind
it. And, and it works so much

504
00:31:04,980 --> 00:31:10,050
better with crypto. Because you
don't have that ridiculous, you

505
00:31:10,050 --> 00:31:14,730
know, whatever it is 29 cent
plus 3.1%, blah, blah, blah, you

506
00:31:14,730 --> 00:31:18,840
know, of every single payment.
It just works so much better

507
00:31:18,870 --> 00:31:22,800
with it. And so I think that was
one side, but the other side was

508
00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:28,650
just just the whole streaming
SATs thing left me quite cold.

509
00:31:29,100 --> 00:31:33,090
But as soon as the booster gram
corner cannula, or booster grams

510
00:31:33,090 --> 00:31:36,600
came along, because you know, as
I as I've been telling other

511
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:41,220
people this, it's a way of
getting feedback from your

512
00:31:41,220 --> 00:31:45,450
audience, which you know, I'm a
radio guy, I used to get lots of

513
00:31:45,450 --> 00:31:49,110
feedback from my audience. That
was great. But it's a way of

514
00:31:49,110 --> 00:31:51,270
getting feedback from your
audience that is always

515
00:31:51,270 --> 00:31:55,980
positive. Because if you are
spending money, sending a

516
00:31:56,250 --> 00:31:59,160
message, sending a booster gram,
it's always going to be

517
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:01,470
positive. You're not You're not
going to be spending money

518
00:32:01,470 --> 00:32:02,340
saying hey, you

519
00:32:02,340 --> 00:32:06,630
suck. You're rubbish. You should
live my life. What are you

520
00:32:06,630 --> 00:32:13,110
talking about? That's when it
feels extra special. Yeah.

521
00:32:14,070 --> 00:32:17,280
When somebody does spend money,
that you're a pile of crap.

522
00:32:17,310 --> 00:32:19,650
Yeah. I mean, that makes you
feel good inside you like

523
00:32:22,290 --> 00:32:24,240
good point. Very good point.

524
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:27,720
No, but I bet I just I just
really liked that there was, you

525
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:32,100
know, when I was on the on the
radio, it was a long, long time

526
00:32:32,100 --> 00:32:36,480
ago. And the way that the
audience would communicate would

527
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:42,420
either be a telephone call? Or,
or letters, letters through the

528
00:32:42,420 --> 00:32:46,170
post. Yep. Sacks form? And you
would, yeah, and you would wait

529
00:32:46,170 --> 00:32:49,740
three or four? Well, not not in
terms of me. You would wait

530
00:32:49,740 --> 00:32:52,530
three or four days. And then And
then something that you had

531
00:32:52,530 --> 00:32:56,730
said, four days ago, somebody
would send you a little Brian

532
00:32:56,730 --> 00:32:59,490
Right, you know, and spend some
time and spend some money on the

533
00:32:59,490 --> 00:33:03,870
Royal Mail and, you know, and
all this kind of stuff. And, you

534
00:33:03,870 --> 00:33:08,580
know, and I and and two things
happened when we started getting

535
00:33:08,610 --> 00:33:12,210
SMS messages, and then of
course, email and, you know, and

536
00:33:12,210 --> 00:33:15,150
everything else, two things
happen. Firstly, the feedback

537
00:33:15,150 --> 00:33:18,990
was instant, absolutely instant.
As soon as you started a new

538
00:33:18,990 --> 00:33:22,350
song a bit, you get people
saying, What's this? What's this

539
00:33:22,350 --> 00:33:28,380
rubbish. But also secondly, it
was it opened up the floodgates

540
00:33:28,380 --> 00:33:31,410
for people to be negative. And I
think if I was a radio

541
00:33:31,410 --> 00:33:36,120
presenter, you know, over the
last 10 years, which I've not

542
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:38,580
been, I've not been behind the
microphone for the last 10

543
00:33:38,580 --> 00:33:40,740
years. If I was a radio
presenter over the last 10

544
00:33:40,740 --> 00:33:43,800
years, my god you know, you'd
need to be really strong you

545
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:46,200
need to be really mentally
strong because you just have

546
00:33:46,500 --> 00:33:50,040
every single time you opened
your mouth, you'd have feedback

547
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:53,430
so who's rubbish? What's this
rubbish song you're playing? You

548
00:33:53,430 --> 00:33:54,150
know and all of that.

549
00:33:54,150 --> 00:33:56,100
Do you not have Twitter James
Cridland?

550
00:33:58,350 --> 00:34:02,190
Well, yeah, you know, I mean,
you know, Twitter is Twitter is

551
00:34:02,190 --> 00:34:05,910
fine, but you're not you're not
performing you know, you're

552
00:34:05,910 --> 00:34:06,270
there

553
00:34:06,270 --> 00:34:11,370
your show there. But there's the
difference for me. And there's a

554
00:34:11,370 --> 00:34:17,010
difference between a radio show
that is turned into a podcast

555
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:21,930
and a podcast. It's all of that
it's Yes sure. It's a show and

556
00:34:21,930 --> 00:34:24,300
sure you can think about it but
you're not you're no longer

557
00:34:24,300 --> 00:34:28,800
constrained so tightly you don't
have to hit the ad break you

558
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:33,510
don't have to hit the top you
don't you don't you know if you

559
00:34:34,110 --> 00:34:37,200
these days it's very rare even
for except perhaps for the

560
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:40,560
powerful morning jock to
actually break the format and

561
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:44,640
replace a song. Oh my god. I
mean, that kind of stuff. The

562
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:47,160
music directors hotline. What
did you do, man? I'm looking at

563
00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,380
the list. I can't believe you
Jane DacMagic wrong. I

564
00:34:49,380 --> 00:34:53,790
will tell you what I tell you
what my my most fun was. I used

565
00:34:53,790 --> 00:34:56,490
to be the swing jock on a radio
station it used to reach about

566
00:34:56,490 --> 00:34:59,190
1.2 million people. Familiar

567
00:34:59,220 --> 00:34:59,970
terminology though.

568
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:04,290
Yeah, no, don't say that in
America, James, this just people

569
00:35:04,290 --> 00:35:07,200
don't understand exactly what
that is. Oh, no Swing.

570
00:35:07,470 --> 00:35:10,710
Swing chop may be something
completely different. Yes, sir.

571
00:35:11,190 --> 00:35:14,730
Much like, Please, can I can I
catch your flag? Yeah.

572
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:21,270
Completely different. Yes. So I
used to be the radio DJ who was

573
00:35:21,270 --> 00:35:25,080
on Dave When other radio DJs
were having a holiday, because I

574
00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,450
wasn't good enough. For it's

575
00:35:27,450 --> 00:35:32,460
called, therefore, baby string,
B string. We've all done it.

576
00:35:33,240 --> 00:35:36,570
Yes. Yeah, we've all we've all
done. Yeah, of course. So

577
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:40,320
while and so one of the things I
loved about that is that I would

578
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:43,800
get some of the weird shows that
nobody would necessarily want to

579
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:47,850
end up doing. And Christmas
breakfast is a fantastic time to

580
00:35:47,850 --> 00:35:51,390
be on the radio. I was on the
radio between six and 10 in the

581
00:35:51,390 --> 00:35:53,880
morning, which is great, because
frankly, you know, you've got

582
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:57,510
the whole Christmas day in front
of you, six until 10. Here I am,

583
00:35:57,540 --> 00:36:01,410
you know, playing some songs
and, and whatever. And just the

584
00:36:01,410 --> 00:36:05,550
amount of calls that you get is
great. But also, I was given the

585
00:36:05,550 --> 00:36:10,680
same music log for a typical
breakfast with you know, with

586
00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:16,380
the breakfast Zoo, and people.
And so therefore I had I had you

587
00:36:16,380 --> 00:36:20,700
know, I was there. In my first
hour go. It's only half past

588
00:36:20,700 --> 00:36:24,210
six. And I've run out of songs.
I literally run out of songs. So

589
00:36:24,210 --> 00:36:27,360
I started I started playing it
was Christmas practice. And so I

590
00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:31,050
thought, right, I'm just going
to play any old Christmas music.

591
00:36:31,050 --> 00:36:34,020
I ended up this was a top 40
station. I ended up playing

592
00:36:34,020 --> 00:36:35,280
Doris Day. Yeah.

593
00:36:35,790 --> 00:36:38,160
You ended up getting fired. Just
what happened?

594
00:36:38,339 --> 00:36:43,949
Yeah. No, no, no, not not. Not
only was I not fired, I realized

595
00:36:43,979 --> 00:36:48,449
quite late in the show that the
next person on was the program

596
00:36:48,449 --> 00:36:52,019
director was coming in and
taking over and he came in and

597
00:36:52,019 --> 00:36:53,759
he just said, I really like the
music. You've

598
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:57,270
got lucky. But it was

599
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,280
just fantastic. I mean, just
what a great time to be on the

600
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:05,850
radio. And now of course, it's
completely automated. It'll be

601
00:37:05,850 --> 00:37:09,390
from you know, hundreds if not
1000s of miles away. Even and

602
00:37:09,420 --> 00:37:10,320
everything else.

603
00:37:10,980 --> 00:37:16,650
The automation part is so did
you I don't know if you saw John

604
00:37:16,650 --> 00:37:21,240
Spurlock tweeted something from
a prominent YouTuber. This guy's

605
00:37:21,240 --> 00:37:25,320
got like 15 million subscribers.
Did any of you see? Yeah, yeah,

606
00:37:25,380 --> 00:37:30,180
I saw it. So did you see this
James? It's a he's using

607
00:37:31,140 --> 00:37:35,280
automation and AI. So basically,
he said, He's, this guy's been

608
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:38,550
putting out YouTube content
every 10 years, literally every

609
00:37:38,550 --> 00:37:42,900
day for 10 years. And he said,
Okay, I'm gonna want to retire.

610
00:37:43,530 --> 00:37:48,030
And he said, but um, but I'm not
going to retire the channel. I'm

611
00:37:48,030 --> 00:37:52,980
just going to retire myself. And
what I need is for there to be

612
00:37:52,980 --> 00:37:58,260
content for the channel. So he's
using the audio scheme as like

613
00:37:58,260 --> 00:38:04,710
speech synthesis to clone a
voice and an anime animated on

614
00:38:04,710 --> 00:38:10,440
screen personality. This 3d
animated like a meme?

615
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:14,160
Yes. It's like the man. It's the
metaverse. Basically. He's

616
00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:17,700
crazy. He's gonna be the first
Metaverse, Metaverse star. And

617
00:38:17,700 --> 00:38:20,850
if you look at the videos, it's
like a nightmare.

618
00:38:21,030 --> 00:38:25,350
They're terrible. Yeah, that's
what it looks like to me. Is it

619
00:38:25,350 --> 00:38:29,640
somebody typing? Like somebody
will play through a video game,

620
00:38:29,850 --> 00:38:34,530
and then somebody else will come
back and type some content into

621
00:38:34,530 --> 00:38:38,490
the into a transcript file. It
kind of fits with the scene.

622
00:38:38,670 --> 00:38:42,270
Yeah. And then it will read it
out in this fake voice and the

623
00:38:42,270 --> 00:38:45,210
animated thing will have
reactions to it. And that's the

624
00:38:45,210 --> 00:38:48,690
video and he's gonna put out
these little one a day. And he

625
00:38:48,690 --> 00:38:49,260
says like

626
00:38:49,260 --> 00:38:50,790
Max Headroom, but not good.

627
00:38:52,890 --> 00:38:55,860
But it's the future man. You
know what it is? These are the

628
00:38:55,860 --> 00:39:00,510
training wheels, you know? And
I'll give Zuckerberg this that

629
00:39:00,510 --> 00:39:04,500
Metaverse idea is dynamite.
Because every everyone's primed

630
00:39:04,500 --> 00:39:10,470
for it. And they've learned how
to build object oriented style

631
00:39:10,500 --> 00:39:15,480
in Minecraft. You know, we've
long been since conditioned that

632
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,480
okay, VR headset is not all that
kooky. We understand kind of

633
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:22,260
what it does. Oh, look at the
business applications. It's

634
00:39:22,260 --> 00:39:25,530
going to be perfect. This is a
great place for people to live.

635
00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:28,170
I've checked it out a couple of
the like the open source

636
00:39:28,170 --> 00:39:32,490
metaverse. I mean, it's for me,
it's a total nightmare. I hate

637
00:39:32,490 --> 00:39:35,250
everything about it. But I can
see where you know cuz there you

638
00:39:35,250 --> 00:39:39,180
can be whatever you want to be.
You know, Brian of London had no

639
00:39:39,180 --> 00:39:41,760
legs. I'm sure that's what he
wanted to be when he was doing

640
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:45,330
his little high presentation.
You know, sir, it's,

641
00:39:46,140 --> 00:39:50,880
that's disturbing. It is. It is.
It's disturbing this that things

642
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:55,110
that used to be human are are
increasing because if this thing

643
00:39:55,170 --> 00:39:58,320
type of thing works out, and I
don't know just being triggered

644
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:00,510
by what you said about radio
automation And then that kind of

645
00:40:00,510 --> 00:40:04,500
thing, that human connection is
being taken away from all Yeah.

646
00:40:04,530 --> 00:40:07,350
From the performing arts. Yes,
yes.

647
00:40:07,410 --> 00:40:12,930
Yes. From God. And to me that
that that is what defines what

648
00:40:12,930 --> 00:40:15,960
radio is all about is a human
connection and a shared

649
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:19,650
experience. And that, by the
way, is also what podcasting is

650
00:40:19,650 --> 00:40:22,620
about. Yes, you exactly right
shared experience,

651
00:40:22,620 --> 00:40:25,890
except podcasting is captured at
Radio was forgotten that

652
00:40:25,890 --> 00:40:28,170
important point that you just
made there? That's why you're a

653
00:40:28,170 --> 00:40:29,250
radio consultant.

654
00:40:29,669 --> 00:40:33,059
Mm hmm. Yeah. And I think you
know, radio, in many parts of

655
00:40:33,059 --> 00:40:34,919
the world has forgotten there
are still there are still some

656
00:40:34,919 --> 00:40:37,949
great radio stations. But I
think in, in many parts of the

657
00:40:37,949 --> 00:40:41,309
world, it's, you know, 10 great
songs in a row. You know, it's

658
00:40:41,309 --> 00:40:45,119
an automated system. And, and
that's not necessarily, you

659
00:40:45,119 --> 00:40:49,259
know, that's not what anybody
really wants. And what I think

660
00:40:49,259 --> 00:40:53,459
is interesting is seeing the the
effects of the pandemic on radio

661
00:40:53,459 --> 00:40:57,719
listening, actually, in the
states radio listening dive

662
00:40:57,719 --> 00:41:02,309
bond, here in Australia,
actually, no radio listening,

663
00:41:02,669 --> 00:41:07,139
went up. And it went up,
particularly around those radio

664
00:41:07,139 --> 00:41:10,049
stations that were doing more
than just playing top 40 songs.

665
00:41:10,740 --> 00:41:12,840
And I've heard a lot of it
because a lot of people have

666
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,620
sent me stuff that's going on
radio wise in Australia during

667
00:41:16,650 --> 00:41:20,910
the past 24 months. And it to
me, it sounded like you're

668
00:41:20,910 --> 00:41:24,150
exactly right. Because yet, you
know, all the the big kind of

669
00:41:24,150 --> 00:41:27,390
state run stations, they're just
telling everyone what's

670
00:41:27,390 --> 00:41:30,540
happening. But here it was
Collins, people saying, Oh,

671
00:41:30,540 --> 00:41:33,690
here's what I'm experiencing.
And, you know, the experts and,

672
00:41:33,870 --> 00:41:36,480
and doctors, there was really
the conversation was taking

673
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:41,040
place there. And podcasting is
not even really appropriate for

674
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:45,420
that type of interaction in a
different way. But that, you

675
00:41:45,420 --> 00:41:48,330
know, when you're in an
emergency situation, lockdown,

676
00:41:48,330 --> 00:41:51,960
people are scared. That's when
we had Snowmageddon. When we

677
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:54,690
were locked in, we had no
electricity for five days

678
00:41:54,690 --> 00:41:58,170
couldn't get out the house in
Texas, our local radio station

679
00:41:58,170 --> 00:42:01,440
was that was the connection, it
was better than anything was

680
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:06,000
better than any news source and
the government. Mm hmm. That's

681
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:08,790
what radio was grayed out,
that's when it excels is just

682
00:42:08,970 --> 00:42:11,760
too damn expensive to keep it
running, you know, the rest of

683
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:14,460
the 10 years that is just bland
and not necessary.

684
00:42:15,510 --> 00:42:19,590
I wonder what about like, when
it comes to booshka? Do you

685
00:42:19,590 --> 00:42:22,710
think that they got into that?
Because they're their technology

686
00:42:22,710 --> 00:42:26,790
is novel? Do you think that they
get into that mindset, because

687
00:42:26,790 --> 00:42:29,400
of the strength of Australian
radio? Is that? Did they come

688
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:33,030
out of that? Or are they just
clever guys that had an idea?

689
00:42:33,330 --> 00:42:33,810
Well,

690
00:42:34,860 --> 00:42:37,110
I mean, I think two things on
that. I think firstly, whisker

691
00:42:37,110 --> 00:42:40,410
is is a full service podcast
host, it just happens to have a

692
00:42:40,410 --> 00:42:44,040
feature that Spotify quite
liked. And so you know, that

693
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:45,660
radio repurposing feature?

694
00:42:46,050 --> 00:42:49,020
They're just small, though that
I mean, they don't have based on

695
00:42:49,020 --> 00:42:51,660
the stats that I've seen, I
think they've only got maybe

696
00:42:51,690 --> 00:42:53,250
15,000 podcasts. Is that right?

697
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:56,730
Yeah. And they're still a
relatively small day, they also

698
00:42:56,730 --> 00:43:01,500
sell advertising in shows I
think Freakonomics Radio hear,

699
00:43:02,490 --> 00:43:05,040
they wrap it in terms of
advertising, stuff like that. So

700
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:08,310
there's a bit of that stuff that
goes on as well. But the guy

701
00:43:08,310 --> 00:43:14,670
that runs it was the was a
former, you know, very senior

702
00:43:14,670 --> 00:43:19,260
management person from one of
the big radio groups. And so,

703
00:43:19,260 --> 00:43:22,620
you know, you can probably see
that he would have taken some of

704
00:43:22,620 --> 00:43:27,510
the stuff that he knows, and
pull that into the new business

705
00:43:27,510 --> 00:43:31,260
that he had just just started.
But I mean, weirdly, that that's

706
00:43:31,260 --> 00:43:36,090
what Omni studio was set up for
the other big Australian podcast

707
00:43:36,090 --> 00:43:40,350
host, which is now owned by
heart. What what Omni studios

708
00:43:40,350 --> 00:43:44,040
started up doing was actually
taking bits, it was a really

709
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:46,770
clever thing. It was built into
the radio stations,

710
00:43:47,910 --> 00:43:51,450
infrastructure would record
everything that the radio DJs

711
00:43:51,450 --> 00:43:54,930
would say, or the radio
announcers would say, and it

712
00:43:54,930 --> 00:44:00,780
would then do some clever sort
of building of a radio show just

713
00:44:00,780 --> 00:44:05,100
for you a sort of a personalized
radio show on the show. So yeah,

714
00:44:05,100 --> 00:44:07,350
it was it was I mean, you know,
that

715
00:44:07,590 --> 00:44:11,730
was that plug into dolet or
something like that. So it

716
00:44:11,730 --> 00:44:14,460
was Yeah, I mean, it was
something it was something like

717
00:44:14,460 --> 00:44:18,270
that it was it would plug into
whatever it is that that they

718
00:44:18,270 --> 00:44:22,380
were using here. So RCS rather
than let nobody use it let

719
00:44:22,380 --> 00:44:23,550
anymore I'm sorry.

720
00:44:25,530 --> 00:44:28,200
What are you what are the kids
using these days? James?

721
00:44:28,200 --> 00:44:30,600
sigh Is that oh, they are all
they're all using RCS?

722
00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:31,710
I think RCS

723
00:44:32,100 --> 00:44:32,640
OS I don't

724
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:34,380
know what you're talking about.
Explain to me like

725
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:36,960
oh my god, he says

726
00:44:37,110 --> 00:44:41,190
it's it's it's the it's the
thing that you it's the thing

727
00:44:41,190 --> 00:44:44,490
that holds all of the jingles
and all of the you know, what

728
00:44:44,490 --> 00:44:47,940
what to let would have to let
was this French plant system,

729
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:51,270
Windows player system, and you
will basically go okay, I want

730
00:44:51,270 --> 00:44:53,490
to play this song, followed by
this song followed by this

731
00:44:53,490 --> 00:44:55,890
jingle, followed by this song.
And then there was a little

732
00:44:55,890 --> 00:44:58,890
button on the top left hand side
which was a little picture of an

733
00:44:58,890 --> 00:45:02,100
aeroplane and You press the
little picture of the aeroplane

734
00:45:02,100 --> 00:45:05,220
and it's an it's landing lights
would start to flash. And you'd

735
00:45:05,220 --> 00:45:08,910
know that then you were on
autopilot. So then you could go

736
00:45:08,910 --> 00:45:11,460
out and, and, and or

737
00:45:13,049 --> 00:45:20,159
I heard you want to say I'd have
a fag? Yeah. I'm not gonna do it

738
00:45:20,159 --> 00:45:23,549
again. So basically Dave, this
is this is like I use Mr. List,

739
00:45:23,549 --> 00:45:26,069
you know, it's like a modular
approach. And you know, every,

740
00:45:26,189 --> 00:45:30,179
every station or every DJ can
build their own screens, and you

741
00:45:30,179 --> 00:45:33,419
got to your cart machines and,
you know, your songs and how

742
00:45:33,419 --> 00:45:36,599
they are listed. And the and
then the, it integrates with the

743
00:45:36,599 --> 00:45:39,719
advertising department, and they
control the ad slots in the

744
00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:44,549
rundown, RCS works.com It's
pretty interesting. So that's,

745
00:45:44,609 --> 00:45:45,269
that's high.

746
00:45:45,720 --> 00:45:52,770
owned, owned by iHeart. Yeah.
Yep. As many of these things Oh,

747
00:45:52,919 --> 00:45:54,239
yeah. Okay, that's

748
00:45:54,240 --> 00:45:56,970
a that's a wonder they're broke.
By all

749
00:45:57,509 --> 00:46:01,889
that story, there are different
sad topic. But in general, this,

750
00:46:01,889 --> 00:46:05,549
this is a pet peeve of mine
about Silicon Valley, and VC and

751
00:46:05,549 --> 00:46:12,779
all these sort of startups that
they the tagline of many of the

752
00:46:12,779 --> 00:46:17,699
startups that are that are
looking for exits is, don't do

753
00:46:17,699 --> 00:46:23,039
this thing yourself, you need to
let us do it for you. So that

754
00:46:23,039 --> 00:46:26,879
you can focus on what on the
real core of your business. So

755
00:46:26,879 --> 00:46:30,809
don't waste your time doing this
other thing. But as you need,

756
00:46:30,839 --> 00:46:32,969
because that's not your core
business. So you need to you

757
00:46:32,969 --> 00:46:37,799
need to let us do that. But what
we see the you put the light of

758
00:46:37,799 --> 00:46:43,199
that when you see all of these
other companies in these big

759
00:46:43,199 --> 00:46:47,069
companies, all consolidating and
pulling all that stuff back in

760
00:46:47,069 --> 00:46:50,519
house, none of them are the big
boys. Let's just say Ilana like

761
00:46:50,519 --> 00:46:53,939
drop, the first thing I saw,
this was Dropbox, Dropbox

762
00:46:53,939 --> 00:46:59,489
started hosting its own servers.
Apple is bring starts bringing

763
00:46:59,489 --> 00:47:02,279
all their production and
everything back in house. All

764
00:47:02,279 --> 00:47:05,399
these companies these these
large companies are becoming

765
00:47:05,399 --> 00:47:11,129
more and more vertical, and
sucking all these these other

766
00:47:11,129 --> 00:47:13,559
things that you would think are
not part of their core business

767
00:47:13,559 --> 00:47:15,239
back in and doing it themselves
how

768
00:47:15,240 --> 00:47:18,690
VCs exit. That's, that's the
only way these days IPOs are

769
00:47:18,690 --> 00:47:21,570
rare. Everyone's just building
features for Google, Facebook

770
00:47:21,570 --> 00:47:23,310
and an apple etc.

771
00:47:24,060 --> 00:47:30,300
Yeah, I would love like, that's
my thing is we companies

772
00:47:30,510 --> 00:47:35,220
outsource way too much stuff to
third to third parties under

773
00:47:35,220 --> 00:47:38,130
this guise of well, you know,
we'll pay these guys to do it,

774
00:47:38,130 --> 00:47:41,670
because then we can focus more
on orbit or core business. Yeah,

775
00:47:41,700 --> 00:47:45,240
but no, no huge successful
company actually works that way.

776
00:47:45,240 --> 00:47:47,760
They may for a period of time,
but they usually end up running

777
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,640
everything back in. And you see
that in the podcast industry. I

778
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:54,840
mean, Spotify is going around
buying up radio, people and our

779
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:57,600
hearts sucking up everything
into the world. I mean, nobody

780
00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:02,430
else seems to adhere to that
moniker, except small businesses

781
00:48:02,460 --> 00:48:06,000
get duped into the, you know,
into the ecosystem that allows

782
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:07,620
rich people to get more exit
strategies.

783
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:12,180
Well, it does seem to be a
particularly North American

784
00:48:12,180 --> 00:48:16,680
thing as well, though. There's a
lot of, you know, I mean, I, I

785
00:48:16,680 --> 00:48:21,390
spent some time working on a
piece of boring technology for

786
00:48:21,390 --> 00:48:26,400
cars. And what was interesting
is seeing the European view,

787
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:30,330
which was right, how do we build
this, this technology into is

788
00:48:30,330 --> 00:48:33,480
for radio stations to get into
cars a little bit better? So it

789
00:48:33,480 --> 00:48:36,570
was right, okay, well, how do we
build this technology, where's

790
00:48:36,570 --> 00:48:39,690
the specifications, blah, blah,
blah, that was very much the

791
00:48:39,690 --> 00:48:43,290
European view was, you know,
okay, we want to build this tech

792
00:48:43,290 --> 00:48:47,130
ourselves. And that's cool.
Here's all of these specs, and

793
00:48:47,190 --> 00:48:50,070
all of the American broadcasters
that we were going to, in this

794
00:48:50,070 --> 00:48:52,980
particular case, was saying,
Great, who can do this for us.

795
00:48:54,270 --> 00:48:59,250
And I found that really quite
sad. You know, I mean, in the

796
00:48:59,250 --> 00:49:02,340
same way, you know, when I
worked at the original virgin

797
00:49:02,340 --> 00:49:06,000
radio in London, we built our
own content management system,

798
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:10,350
we built our own website, from
the ground up, we didn't go out

799
00:49:10,350 --> 00:49:13,410
and use, you know, the content
management systems that were

800
00:49:13,410 --> 00:49:15,990
available, because they didn't
do the job very well. And

801
00:49:15,990 --> 00:49:19,050
actually, we knew that we could
do a better job if we built our

802
00:49:19,050 --> 00:49:24,390
own tech in the same way that
pod news does now. And and there

803
00:49:24,390 --> 00:49:28,170
are so many people who will, you
know, for speed and there are

804
00:49:28,170 --> 00:49:31,320
good reasons, you know, for
that, and you know, it's

805
00:49:31,320 --> 00:49:34,470
probably cheaper, but just buy
something off the shelf and try

806
00:49:34,470 --> 00:49:39,240
and, you know, squeeze in as
much as much additional random

807
00:49:39,240 --> 00:49:41,670
code as they possibly can do
instead of just, you know,

808
00:49:41,670 --> 00:49:43,500
building the thing up from the
ground as

809
00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:46,950
well. And there's also the
there's also the monoculture

810
00:49:46,950 --> 00:49:50,100
aspect to it, because when
whenever you develop a huge

811
00:49:50,100 --> 00:49:52,320
monoculture around anything,
look at the log for Jay

812
00:49:52,320 --> 00:49:55,140
vulnerability that's sweeping
like wildfire through the

813
00:49:55,140 --> 00:49:58,110
internet right now. You know,
everyone, everybody is abusing

814
00:49:58,110 --> 00:50:02,310
the same tech. Well, then you
had a huge humongous vendor?

815
00:50:02,670 --> 00:50:03,060
Yeah.

816
00:50:03,780 --> 00:50:07,110
I mean, what we're seeing that
everywhere AWS, I mean, with

817
00:50:07,110 --> 00:50:11,490
everything, kind of with that in
mind, James, if we can just

818
00:50:11,490 --> 00:50:14,550
imagine for a moment
collectively we are the, the

819
00:50:14,550 --> 00:50:18,480
Duchess of Kent, we have two
daughters left, kind of now,

820
00:50:18,510 --> 00:50:24,150
they're not the prettiest ones.
Can we still marry off blueberry

821
00:50:24,150 --> 00:50:30,030
and Lipson? Yeah,

822
00:50:30,060 --> 00:50:33,570
there's a question. There is an
interesting question. I mean, I

823
00:50:33,570 --> 00:50:35,400
think Libsyn

824
00:50:36,150 --> 00:50:39,960
seems to Lipson seems too messy
seemed like everything. I know,

825
00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:42,750
I don't know if they cleaned it
up with that last guy. But it's

826
00:50:42,750 --> 00:50:45,090
like, oh, the accounting and
there's issues and there's

827
00:50:45,090 --> 00:50:46,830
dangling crap.

828
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:50,010
Yeah. I mean, I think to be
fair, I think you get that with

829
00:50:50,010 --> 00:50:54,930
any large, large company. And I
think, you know, you you, you

830
00:50:54,930 --> 00:50:58,110
know, it's just that the fact
that Libsyn is a quoted company,

831
00:50:58,110 --> 00:51:01,290
it means that they have to tell
the SEC about this means that

832
00:51:01,290 --> 00:51:04,860
they are far more visible in
terms of what they're doing. I

833
00:51:04,860 --> 00:51:09,270
think Libsyn is a heritage
podcast host, which, I mean, it

834
00:51:09,270 --> 00:51:13,230
was one of the first if not the
first. And I think one of the

835
00:51:13,230 --> 00:51:16,470
difficulties that you're about,
and that was

836
00:51:16,500 --> 00:51:19,050
well, now I'm laughing because
it makes it makes me think it

837
00:51:19,050 --> 00:51:21,810
makes me think of heritage
turkey for some reason. I don't

838
00:51:21,810 --> 00:51:25,290
know. It's just like, yeah,
that's Yeah, okay. Okay, I'm

839
00:51:25,290 --> 00:51:26,100
with you. Okay.

840
00:51:27,390 --> 00:51:31,350
So I think I think you know,
what Libsyn has is it doesn't

841
00:51:31,350 --> 00:51:35,940
seem from from this far out, it
doesn't seem to have enough devs

842
00:51:35,940 --> 00:51:40,890
working there. They've been
promoting Libsyn, five new rules

843
00:51:40,890 --> 00:51:45,390
for five years. Yeah. For like
many years. And it just seems to

844
00:51:45,390 --> 00:51:49,920
me if I was the new, the new guy
that's running that place, now

845
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:54,060
Brad's to pack I would be
doubling if not tripling the

846
00:51:54,060 --> 00:51:57,870
amount of devs are working on
that on that stuff, and just

847
00:51:57,870 --> 00:52:03,660
move forward? Or just go out and
buy, you know, a modern podcast

848
00:52:03,660 --> 00:52:09,990
host? And retrofit stuff in? How
about some new clients?

849
00:52:10,140 --> 00:52:13,950
How awesome incest? Why don't we
have Lipson by blueberry?

850
00:52:16,170 --> 00:52:19,590
Well, I think blueberry has the
same issue in the in that

851
00:52:19,590 --> 00:52:22,470
actually, you know, again,
there's an awful lot of heritage

852
00:52:22,470 --> 00:52:26,280
code in there's an awful lot of
technical debt. And there's an

853
00:52:26,280 --> 00:52:29,910
awful lot that needs that needs
rewriting and rebuilding in both

854
00:52:29,910 --> 00:52:32,580
of those companies, which, which
is interesting when you then

855
00:52:32,580 --> 00:52:35,370
have a look at the other ones
that are much the same sort of

856
00:52:35,370 --> 00:52:38,820
size, like Buzzsprout, for
example, they've been very

857
00:52:38,820 --> 00:52:43,710
nimble, they've been very quick
to, you know, to do new things.

858
00:52:44,940 --> 00:52:47,880
And you know, and that is
probably because their tech is

859
00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:50,910
in a much better, better place.
I mean, there are also

860
00:52:50,910 --> 00:52:55,200
personality issues at Lipson,
which will not go into but I

861
00:52:55,200 --> 00:52:59,250
think that that's also been
holding things back as well. But

862
00:52:59,280 --> 00:52:59,490
But

863
00:52:59,490 --> 00:53:02,700
ultimately, the question is, is
there a suitor? Is there is

864
00:53:02,700 --> 00:53:03,450
there someone out

865
00:53:03,450 --> 00:53:06,570
there as that's who I was gonna
ask that what who's the next?

866
00:53:06,570 --> 00:53:09,090
Who's the next podcast host to
get sucked up? Or no,

867
00:53:09,090 --> 00:53:11,730
but Who's Buying? And who's
going to buy as the question? I

868
00:53:11,730 --> 00:53:14,670
mean, let's just forget the
obvious, Spotify, blah, blah,

869
00:53:14,670 --> 00:53:17,850
blah, I don't, it's got is there
another radio? I'm

870
00:53:17,850 --> 00:53:18,690
gonna be interested,

871
00:53:18,720 --> 00:53:23,010
but is there a radio related
organization that would want to

872
00:53:23,010 --> 00:53:25,830
do the same trick as everyone
else seems to be doing? That's

873
00:53:25,830 --> 00:53:26,670
kind of where I'm going,

874
00:53:27,240 --> 00:53:29,970
huh? Yeah. And it's interesting,
because actually, there are

875
00:53:29,970 --> 00:53:35,100
quite a few radio companies who
are using megaphone issues, of

876
00:53:35,100 --> 00:53:39,900
course, Spotify, so you don't
necessarily want to be doing

877
00:53:39,900 --> 00:53:40,380
that, because

878
00:53:40,650 --> 00:53:43,290
they're all they're all gonna
want to do this. Everyone sees

879
00:53:43,290 --> 00:53:45,900
the future, they know they have
to go there might as well get a

880
00:53:45,900 --> 00:53:49,590
host. You've got everything all
in one go. Yeah, maybe heritage

881
00:53:49,590 --> 00:53:51,900
but also Turkey tasty. So

882
00:53:51,900 --> 00:53:56,490
on the on the other side, if
they continue using the product

883
00:53:56,490 --> 00:54:00,900
that they're already using, if
they continue using megaphone,

884
00:54:00,900 --> 00:54:04,830
then they're giving all of their
stats to Spotify. If they

885
00:54:04,830 --> 00:54:07,920
continue using simple cars,
they're giving all of their

886
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:11,880
stats to Sirius XM, which is a
competitor. If they continue

887
00:54:11,880 --> 00:54:14,730
using Omni studio, then they're
giving all of their stats to I

888
00:54:14,730 --> 00:54:17,040
heart, you know, at the end of
the day, which is their

889
00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:21,540
competitor. So therefore, if
you're a large publisher,

890
00:54:21,570 --> 00:54:24,540
regardless of whether or not
you're a radio company, you

891
00:54:24,540 --> 00:54:27,630
probably need to be keeping that
sort of, you know, the crown

892
00:54:27,630 --> 00:54:31,380
jewels of your stats and
everything else in house, rather

893
00:54:31,380 --> 00:54:34,740
than giving it to your
competitors to run doesn't seem

894
00:54:34,740 --> 00:54:36,300
like a bright plan.

895
00:54:36,300 --> 00:54:39,930
Well, if they just will convert
to podcasting 2.0 and value for

896
00:54:39,930 --> 00:54:46,890
value, we'll give them stats and
SATs. Instead of pursuing the

897
00:54:46,890 --> 00:54:51,150
dead model of of interruptive
advertising, maybe we've eaten

898
00:54:51,150 --> 00:54:53,670
this horse to death. Yes. All
right. Well, that

899
00:54:53,670 --> 00:54:58,050
Well, I mean, that kind of takes
me back to a couple as I said

900
00:54:58,050 --> 00:55:02,280
this couple of weeks ago and I'm
not sure that I made a good

901
00:55:02,280 --> 00:55:06,630
point of it. But it seems to me
that the hosting companies that

902
00:55:06,630 --> 00:55:11,220
are successful in an organic
way, and I don't mean like with

903
00:55:11,220 --> 00:55:14,700
an exit strategy or a buy up, I
mean, they're, they're just

904
00:55:14,700 --> 00:55:18,180
naturally successful. The ones
that I'm seeing that are that,

905
00:55:18,300 --> 00:55:21,720
that are that they are
successful because they're

906
00:55:21,720 --> 00:55:28,830
doubling down on what podcasting
core core customer is. And I

907
00:55:28,830 --> 00:55:31,560
don't mean, on the listener
side, I mean, on the, on the on

908
00:55:31,560 --> 00:55:35,520
the host side, on the host on
the podcast, creator side, it's

909
00:55:35,550 --> 00:55:40,050
day, but they are companies that
are saying, Okay, we know that

910
00:55:40,500 --> 00:55:45,390
50% of the entire market is our
independent podcasters who don't

911
00:55:45,390 --> 00:55:49,950
necessarily even care about
monetizing them. And they're

912
00:55:49,950 --> 00:55:52,770
saying, Okay, we're going to
serve that audience. Those are

913
00:55:52,770 --> 00:55:57,270
our customers. And we're going
to make podcasting. super

914
00:55:57,270 --> 00:56:00,630
enjoyable for them. We're never
even going to mention

915
00:56:01,140 --> 00:56:04,800
programmatic, we're not going to
do any of that stuff. We're just

916
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:07,680
going to double down on this.
Yeah, this segment, I

917
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:10,680
think, I think there's probably
there's probably a middle ground

918
00:56:10,680 --> 00:56:14,730
there. And I think what what I
was interested in Mark and Kira

919
00:56:14,730 --> 00:56:19,170
and doing it to captivate is
that they changed the, the

920
00:56:19,170 --> 00:56:22,680
unofficial sort of slogan of
their, of their company over to,

921
00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:26,550
you know, we are here for the
serious independent podcaster.

922
00:56:27,330 --> 00:56:30,450
And I really liked that serious
independent podcast is somebody

923
00:56:30,450 --> 00:56:33,690
who isn't doing it as a hobby,
which is what anchor is there

924
00:56:33,690 --> 00:56:37,860
for. It's somebody who is, you
know, clearly not part of the

925
00:56:37,860 --> 00:56:41,040
big, you know, the big groups,
they're not, they're not going

926
00:56:41,040 --> 00:56:48,330
out finding, finding, you know,
corporate clients, and then

927
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:51,240
everything else, they are
specifically there for the

928
00:56:51,240 --> 00:56:54,150
serious independent podcaster.
And I thought that that's,

929
00:56:54,180 --> 00:56:58,170
that's a neat plan. And if you
build the tools that a serious

930
00:56:58,170 --> 00:57:01,440
independent podcaster might
want, you might end up building

931
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:07,950
a DIY solution as Captivate did,
yeah. But that's a DI solution

932
00:57:07,950 --> 00:57:13,050
that 10% 15% of their customers
will use, but it's a well

933
00:57:13,080 --> 00:57:16,500
executed one that, you know,
that will keep those customers

934
00:57:16,500 --> 00:57:21,270
that want to di, you know, plan
with with that particular

935
00:57:21,270 --> 00:57:24,690
company, you know, and
similarly, you know, if you

936
00:57:24,690 --> 00:57:29,370
want, you know, all manner of
these other, you know, there are

937
00:57:29,370 --> 00:57:33,570
some podcasters that want you to
have magic mastering as

938
00:57:33,690 --> 00:57:36,750
Buzzsprout to where, you know,
it did sorts out your, your

939
00:57:36,750 --> 00:57:39,330
levels and everything else. And
that's, and that's great stuff.

940
00:57:39,330 --> 00:57:43,560
I think, I think where you're
seeing interesting podcast hosts

941
00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:47,370
moving is adding a bunch of
additional features for those

942
00:57:47,370 --> 00:57:51,180
people that would use those to
make it harder for them to

943
00:57:51,210 --> 00:57:52,020
switch away.

944
00:57:52,860 --> 00:57:56,190
It's all it's always a great way
to I mean, that's the only true

945
00:57:56,190 --> 00:58:00,720
way to compete is on features
and service. At a price. Sure,

946
00:58:00,720 --> 00:58:04,170
but ultimately, it comes down to
you know, people will pay for

947
00:58:04,200 --> 00:58:06,060
something they really like.

948
00:58:06,090 --> 00:58:10,230
Yeah. And and, you know, it's
what I liked about the captivate

949
00:58:10,980 --> 00:58:13,140
you know, I mean, again, you
were you were you were saying

950
00:58:13,140 --> 00:58:16,560
earlier that it took me a while
to get on board with the whole

951
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:20,970
idea of cryptocurrency. It also
took me a time to get on board

952
00:58:20,970 --> 00:58:24,570
with the way that captivate was
charging its customers. Because

953
00:58:24,570 --> 00:58:27,360
unlike anybody else, Captivate
was charging his customers based

954
00:58:27,360 --> 00:58:30,870
on the total downloads that you
get, and you look at that, and

955
00:58:30,870 --> 00:58:33,540
you go, that's a weird way of
charging people, nobody else

956
00:58:33,540 --> 00:58:37,740
charges people that way. So if I
get 30,000 downloads, and I'm

957
00:58:37,740 --> 00:58:41,670
going to pay more than than a
podcaster, that gets 10,000

958
00:58:41,670 --> 00:58:44,070
downloads, and then you look at
it the other way around, and you

959
00:58:44,070 --> 00:58:47,490
go well, a that's where the main
cost is that and customer

960
00:58:47,490 --> 00:58:52,710
support. But also be the more
successful your podcast is, the

961
00:58:52,710 --> 00:58:55,800
more you'll end up paying, which
means that the company really

962
00:58:55,800 --> 00:58:58,950
wants to make your podcast
really successful. You know,

963
00:58:58,980 --> 00:59:01,380
yeah, so actually, it says it's
this sort of, you know,

964
00:59:01,380 --> 00:59:04,950
interesting, virtuous circle in
terms of, you know, in terms of

965
00:59:04,950 --> 00:59:06,120
a way in a way

966
00:59:06,900 --> 00:59:10,200
that also forces you into into
monetizing, though, that that

967
00:59:10,200 --> 00:59:13,050
forces you to have to monetize
at a certain level. I mean, that

968
00:59:13,890 --> 00:59:14,490
it just pushed.

969
00:59:15,450 --> 00:59:17,970
But I think, you know, once
you've once you've reached

970
00:59:18,420 --> 00:59:21,990
10,000 downloads per per
episode, then it's the sort of

971
00:59:21,990 --> 00:59:25,470
thing that you're likely to be
considering monetizing anyway,

972
00:59:25,500 --> 00:59:29,190
but you but you could be
monetizing in a in a much nicer

973
00:59:29,190 --> 00:59:31,890
way than a 32nd ad. Yeah.

974
00:59:32,190 --> 00:59:34,470
You know, we've we've
successfully spoken about

975
00:59:34,470 --> 00:59:38,160
nothing in podcasting 2.0 For
the past year. I'm very proud of

976
00:59:38,160 --> 00:59:39,750
us for that. I do want to

977
00:59:40,080 --> 00:59:43,470
relate to the shows podcasting.
1.0 Right. Well, but

978
00:59:43,470 --> 00:59:47,310
this is interesting, and I think
relevant and I don't know James

979
00:59:47,310 --> 00:59:49,650
if you had much time to think
about this, but this keeps

980
00:59:49,650 --> 00:59:54,690
popping up to me in the honestly
I find it annoying, but I'm I'm

981
00:59:54,720 --> 00:59:57,840
cognizant that this is what this
is going to be with us. It's

982
00:59:57,840 --> 01:00:00,660
coming and there's so many
different versions. Have what it

983
01:00:00,660 --> 01:00:06,690
means. And that's web three. And
what I feel coming is this

984
01:00:06,690 --> 01:00:10,050
bullcrap term that has been
created for Silicon Valley

985
01:00:10,050 --> 01:00:13,410
companies. Basically, it's
replaced blockchain for Silicon

986
01:00:13,410 --> 01:00:18,930
Valley companies to raise money
on to go ahead and build things

987
01:00:18,930 --> 01:00:23,490
and give away more free crap to
prove that the distributed world

988
01:00:23,490 --> 01:00:26,010
that they own the distributed
world, which of course, is

989
01:00:26,040 --> 01:00:30,870
insane on its face, because the
whole idea is this distribute

990
01:00:30,900 --> 01:00:35,130
distributed everything. And
really, and I've written several

991
01:00:35,370 --> 01:00:38,580
definitions. And I think the, in
fact, it's interesting how

992
01:00:38,580 --> 01:00:43,050
podcasting 2.0 Fits is, to some
degree, the idea is distributed

993
01:00:43,050 --> 01:00:47,970
load and distributed share in
what I call the value flow, but

994
01:00:47,970 --> 01:00:51,210
that would be micropayments, or
money or some other some other

995
01:00:51,210 --> 01:00:55,350
value transfer. And that is, you
know, clearly a lot of that's on

996
01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:59,490
blockchain. But somehow it's a,
it's a bit of a combination of

997
01:00:59,490 --> 01:01:03,630
how value for value. Streaming
payments works with the app,

998
01:01:04,080 --> 01:01:07,590
developer getting a piece and
the value splits. At the same

999
01:01:07,590 --> 01:01:12,570
time, it's part of what Brian of
London has done with his, his

1000
01:01:12,570 --> 01:01:16,950
hive contraption and what's
happening over there. Yeah, so

1001
01:01:16,950 --> 01:01:21,030
that's kind of the open the open
world that's really kind of

1002
01:01:21,030 --> 01:01:24,900
really doing this and the Dow's
the distributed autonomous

1003
01:01:24,900 --> 01:01:28,710
organizations that are using
smart contracts to you know,

1004
01:01:30,360 --> 01:01:33,210
invest in a cause or do
something positive that that

1005
01:01:33,210 --> 01:01:37,650
community wants, all away from
Silicon Valley. So that means at

1006
01:01:37,650 --> 01:01:39,780
the same time for me, and this
is I'm going to get to a

1007
01:01:39,780 --> 01:01:44,970
question eventually, is, it
feels like web three will bring

1008
01:01:45,000 --> 01:01:50,850
a lot of opportunity, and a lot
of tools that will be really

1009
01:01:50,850 --> 01:01:53,700
helpful for everybody that
ultimately, these companies may

1010
01:01:53,700 --> 01:01:58,020
never be able to monetize or
exit from. But there's gonna be

1011
01:01:58,020 --> 01:02:01,290
a lot of money pouring into
this, this kind of concept, and

1012
01:02:01,290 --> 01:02:06,960
that could obliterate the entire
storage and bandwidth issue for

1013
01:02:06,960 --> 01:02:10,830
every single hosting company
we're talking about. Which

1014
01:02:10,830 --> 01:02:13,830
literally, then brings it down
to features and service.

1015
01:02:15,780 --> 01:02:20,220
Yeah, and, you know, I mean, I
think, I think, I think features

1016
01:02:20,220 --> 01:02:26,100
and services is, is is the way
to go. And, yeah, I mean, it

1017
01:02:26,100 --> 01:02:28,950
does worry me that, you know,
and you've put it so eloquently

1018
01:02:28,950 --> 01:02:35,610
there, Adam, that, you know, the
whole point, in a lot of what is

1019
01:02:35,610 --> 01:02:41,070
going on here is making sure
that there isn't one company in

1020
01:02:41,070 --> 01:02:44,040
charge of anything. And I think
that's the, it's the

1021
01:02:44,040 --> 01:02:48,270
frustrating, but also brilliant
thing about the podcasting 2.0

1022
01:02:48,270 --> 01:02:51,600
stuff that you've been doing is
that nobody is actually in

1023
01:02:51,600 --> 01:02:56,460
charge of, you know, is in
charge of anything terms of how

1024
01:02:56,460 --> 01:03:02,040
that how the system works, and,
you know, etc. And that means

1025
01:03:02,040 --> 01:03:06,270
that it's slower, because you
haven't got large, a large

1026
01:03:06,270 --> 01:03:10,260
company pushing it because they
they won't make money from, you

1027
01:03:10,260 --> 01:03:15,600
know, their, for their VCs.
Because it isn't a proprietary

1028
01:03:15,600 --> 01:03:23,010
thing. But it also means that it
is, or it should be more, more

1029
01:03:23,010 --> 01:03:26,970
permanent, because everybody
owns it, because it's available

1030
01:03:26,970 --> 01:03:30,330
to everybody. And I think that's
the I was thinking about this,

1031
01:03:30,360 --> 01:03:35,400
this this morning, that there's
a big there's a big amount of

1032
01:03:35,400 --> 01:03:40,200
friction between the corporate
world, the VC funded corporate

1033
01:03:40,200 --> 01:03:44,340
world, and podcasting, because
podcasting has always been

1034
01:03:44,370 --> 01:03:50,370
designed to be open to be as
available on as many different

1035
01:03:50,370 --> 01:03:53,250
platforms as you possibly can,
because of the great work that

1036
01:03:53,250 --> 01:03:59,520
you that you're doing, Adam, and
and the frustration is seeing

1037
01:03:59,520 --> 01:04:02,760
companies like Spotify go, Well,
we're going to do video

1038
01:04:02,760 --> 01:04:06,690
podcasting in a different way.
And an Amazon going well, we're

1039
01:04:06,690 --> 01:04:10,620
going to do, you know,
transcripts in a, you know, in

1040
01:04:10,650 --> 01:04:13,920
in our own way. And you know,
and the creators aren't actually

1041
01:04:13,920 --> 01:04:17,070
going to be given the chance to
edit their own transcripts,

1042
01:04:17,070 --> 01:04:21,570
which is mental. And all of that
kind of stuff of that that to me

1043
01:04:21,570 --> 01:04:25,590
is is the real friction going on
at the moment. I mean, I was

1044
01:04:25,590 --> 01:04:30,720
reading something yesterday, the
BBC sounds app. So the app that

1045
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:34,980
the BBC uses to do live radio
and podcasts and everything

1046
01:04:34,980 --> 01:04:39,480
else, they were crowing about
the fact that they've had 25%

1047
01:04:39,480 --> 01:04:42,420
More podcast listeners this year
than they had last year within

1048
01:04:42,420 --> 01:04:46,410
their app. But what they're not
releasing is the total amount of

1049
01:04:46,410 --> 01:04:49,440
podcast downloads that they've
had in the last year in

1050
01:04:49,440 --> 01:04:52,740
comparison to the before, across
all platforms. They're just

1051
01:04:52,740 --> 01:04:55,920
focusing on their app because
it's it's our app and we own it.

1052
01:04:56,340 --> 01:04:57,030
You know, it's

1053
01:04:57,090 --> 01:04:59,880
a New York Times is about to do
the same thing. Yeah, yeah.

1054
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:01,500
Yeah, exactly. And

1055
01:05:01,500 --> 01:05:05,100
you know, I always, I always
talk about and this is sort of

1056
01:05:05,100 --> 01:05:07,950
radio jargon. But I always talk
about these apps being p one

1057
01:05:07,980 --> 01:05:13,230
apps, there are apps for the
people who, who, who already

1058
01:05:13,230 --> 01:05:17,280
have a preference number one,
for this particular company. So

1059
01:05:17,640 --> 01:05:21,300
the New York Times audio app is
going to be downloaded by people

1060
01:05:21,300 --> 01:05:24,570
who love the New York Times. And
that's great. But people who

1061
01:05:24,570 --> 01:05:26,670
don't love the New York Times
are never going to download this

1062
01:05:26,670 --> 01:05:31,050
thing. Because why on earth
would they, whereas a podcast

1063
01:05:31,050 --> 01:05:35,610
app has all of their stuff in it
anyway. And a good podcast that

1064
01:05:35,610 --> 01:05:40,860
will help people find new shows
that they haven't yet found. And

1065
01:05:40,860 --> 01:05:45,180
so actually, a good podcast app
is so much better to these

1066
01:05:45,180 --> 01:05:48,810
companies than building their
own stuff, when that's sticking

1067
01:05:48,810 --> 01:05:50,490
their own stuff into a, you
know,

1068
01:05:50,520 --> 01:05:55,470
that's what I would love to see.
And corporations can do this.

1069
01:05:55,470 --> 01:06:00,660
But hobby clubs and individuals,
I would love to see it. Even if

1070
01:06:00,660 --> 01:06:04,680
just a web app. You know, I'm a
big fan of the web app. Just,

1071
01:06:04,860 --> 01:06:08,580
you know, like, how about True
Crime only, you know, and curate

1072
01:06:08,580 --> 01:06:12,660
the homepage or whatever I you
know, I can see what the

1073
01:06:12,660 --> 01:06:16,110
knitting knitting communities
huge and curate the homepage. He

1074
01:06:16,110 --> 01:06:18,900
got something going there. It's
not that hard. Yeah, I mean, I'm

1075
01:06:19,080 --> 01:06:22,200
saying that, yeah, simply. But
there's open source code

1076
01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:25,890
available. We can have so many
different types of apps for

1077
01:06:25,890 --> 01:06:28,260
specific groups. I've no problem
with that.

1078
01:06:28,740 --> 01:06:32,310
But so there's a there's an app,
which launched yesterday on both

1079
01:06:32,310 --> 01:06:36,540
iOS and Android. So on real
phones and, and pretend ones

1080
01:06:36,690 --> 01:06:38,490
with you on that. James, you
know that

1081
01:06:39,690 --> 01:06:44,580
called Apollo? And Apollo is a
podcast out but it's just for

1082
01:06:44,580 --> 01:06:47,370
fiction podcasts. Yeah. Oh,
yeah. Really talking about that?

1083
01:06:47,370 --> 01:06:50,610
Yep. So it's got a better list
of genres. It's got a better

1084
01:06:50,610 --> 01:06:55,140
it's got more curated playlists
in there. Right tools

1085
01:06:55,140 --> 01:06:58,710
specifically for fiction podcast
listeners, but of course, great

1086
01:06:58,710 --> 01:06:59,220
Gray,

1087
01:06:59,400 --> 01:07:02,820
they need to be, you know, on
2.0, they need to be using

1088
01:07:03,180 --> 01:07:08,100
chapters, and they they have it
that 2.00 No,

1089
01:07:08,100 --> 01:07:11,820
but they Mote they most
certainly do. And every time I

1090
01:07:11,820 --> 01:07:15,360
have quite a few podcast app
developers call, you know, call

1091
01:07:15,360 --> 01:07:21,690
me and, and, and have a chat.
And, you know, we're still at a

1092
01:07:21,690 --> 01:07:24,960
point where we need to be
talking to these folks. And

1093
01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:28,440
going well, you know, please. I
mean, I had somebody yesterday,

1094
01:07:28,440 --> 01:07:32,040
who was saying, What can I do to
get you onto my news social

1095
01:07:32,040 --> 01:07:34,650
podcast app, and it's another
one of these social podcast apps

1096
01:07:34,650 --> 01:07:40,740
with comments and everything
else. And I'm just going, I'm

1097
01:07:40,740 --> 01:07:45,150
not really that interested in
another proprietary social

1098
01:07:45,150 --> 01:07:49,410
podcast app, if you're using the
open the open, you know, cross

1099
01:07:49,470 --> 01:07:53,760
across that comments, then
great. I'll happily I'll promote

1100
01:07:53,760 --> 01:07:57,270
you jump into this. And I don't,
but I don't want to be Yeah, but

1101
01:07:57,270 --> 01:08:02,190
I don't want to be, you know,
another podcast app with another

1102
01:08:02,190 --> 01:08:06,510
siloed set of comments that I'll
never get to read anyway. We're

1103
01:08:06,510 --> 01:08:08,610
gonna fix that next year, be the
point of that.

1104
01:08:08,640 --> 01:08:11,370
We're gonna fix the the
comments, we're fixing that.

1105
01:08:12,330 --> 01:08:14,880
That's a no, it's gonna be great
about that. To your to your

1106
01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:19,530
point about corporate friction
versus open source open projects

1107
01:08:19,530 --> 01:08:25,230
like podcasting. 2.0. Yeah,
ultimately, when cross app

1108
01:08:25,230 --> 01:08:29,700
comments are functioning, it
will be because thoughtfulness

1109
01:08:29,700 --> 01:08:35,850
went into it. And love. Hmm,
that's the I mean, there's real

1110
01:08:35,910 --> 01:08:41,790
thoughtfulness about the future
about scenarios about all

1111
01:08:41,790 --> 01:08:48,360
stakeholders. The I, I've said
it before, but the the

1112
01:08:48,360 --> 01:08:52,620
development work and just even
being able to, to, to kind of

1113
01:08:52,620 --> 01:08:56,490
tag along and see how this comes
together. It's one of the most

1114
01:08:56,490 --> 01:08:59,370
beautiful things I've ever seen
in my life. I really love this.

1115
01:08:59,370 --> 01:09:03,660
This is so beautiful to see. And
and if you want more,

1116
01:09:03,660 --> 01:09:04,500
one more word,

1117
01:09:05,010 --> 01:09:06,180
yeah, thank you. I'm running out

1118
01:09:06,180 --> 01:09:11,790
in its obsession as well. But
people are actually are actually

1119
01:09:11,820 --> 01:09:15,930
obsessed with making podcasting
better. Yeah, whether that's

1120
01:09:16,110 --> 01:09:20,040
whether that's adding cross app,
comments, because we can see the

1121
01:09:20,040 --> 01:09:22,920
real benefits of that, whether
it's the whole value for value

1122
01:09:22,920 --> 01:09:26,760
thing, whether it's, you know,
just the basics of, you know,

1123
01:09:26,790 --> 01:09:29,940
some apps out there having
difficulties resizing images, so

1124
01:09:29,940 --> 01:09:36,390
the podcast images, you know,
namespace tag, you know, all of

1125
01:09:36,390 --> 01:09:41,160
that stuff. It's all born out of
real real obsession. And yes,

1126
01:09:41,160 --> 01:09:43,620
you know, and I think that's a
great I think that's a great

1127
01:09:43,620 --> 01:09:45,750
thing if we can if we can
harness that right I think

1128
01:09:45,750 --> 01:09:47,250
that's a fantastic that that was

1129
01:09:47,250 --> 01:09:50,190
being interviewed by Chris
Fisher the other day on on their

1130
01:09:50,190 --> 01:09:54,000
podcast network and he's, I made
this comment with him is that

1131
01:09:55,920 --> 01:10:00,720
when it when it comes to when it
comes to all these types, And,

1132
01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:06,600
and that kind of thing. The
beauty of it is that now there's

1133
01:10:06,600 --> 01:10:12,120
a place to go. It's as I was
making the point that way, as

1134
01:10:12,120 --> 01:10:16,950
soon as you start doing open
standards work, immediately the

1135
01:10:17,160 --> 01:10:21,630
from on high, you start getting
pelted with XKCD, comic

1136
01:10:21,630 --> 01:10:24,270
references and you just start
getting chastised about you

1137
01:10:24,270 --> 01:10:28,530
know, it's like, Well, okay,
yeah, I get it. Okay, fine. Sure

1138
01:10:28,560 --> 01:10:33,390
the funding tag, there was
already a tag in the atom

1139
01:10:33,420 --> 01:10:37,860
namespace with lino rel equals
payment, blah, blah, blah. Sure,

1140
01:10:37,890 --> 01:10:42,060
I get it. There was already a
Yahoo media media, RSS namespace

1141
01:10:42,060 --> 01:10:45,510
and some stuff in there that
could possibly have been

1142
01:10:45,510 --> 01:10:49,140
shoehorned into an alternate
enclosure type scenario. Maybe.

1143
01:10:50,250 --> 01:10:55,290
The problem with those things,
though, is that nobody knows

1144
01:10:55,290 --> 01:10:59,040
who's in control of it. There's
no working group that anybody

1145
01:10:59,040 --> 01:11:05,460
can put their hands on or email.
The RSS coalition is died years

1146
01:11:05,460 --> 01:11:11,190
ago. Do controls Dublin Core?
Anybody? I don't know, who

1147
01:11:11,190 --> 01:11:14,700
controls me. I mean, Yahoo's
been bought and sold 15 times

1148
01:11:14,910 --> 01:11:18,780
that none of these existing
namespaces that did that people

1149
01:11:18,780 --> 01:11:22,080
reference every occasionally on
Twitter, I'll get a post saying,

1150
01:11:22,320 --> 01:11:26,190
Why did you why did you create
this tag, you could have used,

1151
01:11:26,640 --> 01:11:31,140
you know, DC content, blah,
blah, blah? Well, you know, I'm

1152
01:11:31,140 --> 01:11:34,050
sorry, but Dublin Core, as far
as I know, there's no human

1153
01:11:34,050 --> 01:11:36,660
being alive, that actually is in
charge of that thing, or

1154
01:11:36,660 --> 01:11:39,990
extending it or changing it in
any way. The fact that there's a

1155
01:11:40,440 --> 01:11:49,260
podcast namespace is, is an open
modern group on GitHub, did

1156
01:11:49,260 --> 01:11:54,030
exist, that somebody can go and
petition and say, Hey, this

1157
01:11:54,030 --> 01:11:57,990
thing works almost the way I
need it to work. But there's one

1158
01:11:57,990 --> 01:12:01,170
thing that might be missing that
can make it work better in this

1159
01:12:01,170 --> 01:12:05,130
scenario. And you post there,
and you may have 10 people reply

1160
01:12:05,130 --> 01:12:07,620
to you and say, oh, yeah, this,
I could see this, they could

1161
01:12:07,620 --> 01:12:10,560
work this way. And blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah. It's a living,

1162
01:12:10,560 --> 01:12:15,690
breathing spec, it with with
people attached to it. And

1163
01:12:15,690 --> 01:12:20,010
that's something that RSS, and
especially RSS namespace

1164
01:12:20,010 --> 01:12:25,800
extensions haven't had in a very
long time. And so that's, if

1165
01:12:25,800 --> 01:12:29,010
there's one thing. So I guess
what I'm trying to say is,

1166
01:12:29,400 --> 01:12:34,620
you're right, it's an obsession.
And, and it's, it's care. But

1167
01:12:34,650 --> 01:12:40,290
also, it's just showing up.
Because there's a lot of things

1168
01:12:40,290 --> 01:12:47,280
that podcasting could already
almost do. But it just lacked

1169
01:12:47,340 --> 01:12:52,200
that final sort of 10% to bring
it up to be what a modern thing

1170
01:12:52,260 --> 01:12:56,130
of what a modern specification
would need to operate. Because

1171
01:12:56,130 --> 01:12:59,010
the law, so many of these
namespaces have existed for 15

1172
01:12:59,010 --> 01:13:02,490
years. And they'd more like the
blueberry, the blueberry

1173
01:13:02,490 --> 01:13:05,820
namespace, their true voice or
whatever it's called, that spec

1174
01:13:05,820 --> 01:13:08,550
Had Allah had a lot of
interesting stuff. But it was

1175
01:13:08,550 --> 01:13:12,180
built at a time it was created
at a time 15 years ago, where a

1176
01:13:12,180 --> 01:13:15,870
lot of modern tech, the way we
use the internet doubt didn't

1177
01:13:15,870 --> 01:13:20,070
even exist, rest API's didn't
exist. The it was built at a

1178
01:13:20,070 --> 01:13:22,380
different moment in history. So

1179
01:13:22,650 --> 01:13:25,770
and of course, the other and the
other side of it was that it was

1180
01:13:25,770 --> 01:13:30,210
owned, it was owned by Todd's
company brand. So what you've

1181
01:13:30,210 --> 01:13:33,210
basically then gone is you got
Lipson going, Well, why would we

1182
01:13:33,210 --> 01:13:36,030
want that? Because that's that
that's owned by the competitor.

1183
01:13:36,390 --> 01:13:39,420
And that's the beauty of what
you've done is that you have

1184
01:13:39,420 --> 01:13:44,670
something which I mean, it is
owned, but it's owned. It's not

1185
01:13:44,670 --> 01:13:48,030
owned by a big podcast
publisher, nor is it owned by a

1186
01:13:48,030 --> 01:13:50,790
big podcast hosting company,

1187
01:13:50,910 --> 01:13:53,880
they'll say you JG opportunities
you've built as much as this

1188
01:13:53,880 --> 01:13:57,750
namespaces we have. So that's
the there's the that's the

1189
01:13:57,750 --> 01:14:00,750
shared, that's the shared,
shared enjoyment of health, the

1190
01:14:00,750 --> 01:14:06,780
farthest thing is gone. What
what do you think, on that note,

1191
01:14:08,340 --> 01:14:11,940
what do you think is the most
important to I think transcript

1192
01:14:11,940 --> 01:14:14,520
I think maybe we can all agree
that that's the most important

1193
01:14:14,520 --> 01:14:16,740
thing. Present, I

1194
01:14:16,740 --> 01:14:20,400
think, I think right now
transcript is really exciting.

1195
01:14:20,430 --> 01:14:24,660
So you've got a script, which
literally over the weekend, did

1196
01:14:24,660 --> 01:14:29,100
some additional work on their
systems to output the right.

1197
01:14:30,540 --> 01:14:31,290
standard

1198
01:14:31,680 --> 01:14:32,640
JSON and

1199
01:14:34,410 --> 01:14:35,580
TT Oh, they

1200
01:14:35,580 --> 01:14:36,900
do VTT fine. Yeah.

1201
01:14:37,080 --> 01:14:41,880
Yeah. And, and so they, they,
they ended up doing that so that

1202
01:14:42,780 --> 01:14:46,440
so that you've got the files now
completely automatically, that

1203
01:14:46,440 --> 01:14:51,810
work with the podcast transcript
namespace. So, if I add this

1204
01:14:51,810 --> 01:14:52,500
cost money

1205
01:14:54,180 --> 01:15:01,980
D script does. But, but the fact
that They are building that in a

1206
01:15:02,370 --> 01:15:04,830
great interesting, I mean was
great. Wouldn't it be great if

1207
01:15:04,830 --> 01:15:08,400
there was a if there was an open
source, you know, version that

1208
01:15:08,400 --> 01:15:12,720
would just produce the the, the
transcripts, that'd be

1209
01:15:12,720 --> 01:15:13,320
fantastic.

1210
01:15:13,380 --> 01:15:17,130
What I'd like to do is I'd like
to market them if so do you

1211
01:15:17,130 --> 01:15:21,810
basically hand off your mp3 and
boom, you get the file back that

1212
01:15:21,810 --> 01:15:26,490
you need. You know, anyone who
has this kind of service I want

1213
01:15:26,490 --> 01:15:29,790
to promote, because, you know,
this is, this is a big thing.

1214
01:15:29,790 --> 01:15:33,000
Now, people are saying, hey, we
need these for legal reasons, as

1215
01:15:33,000 --> 01:15:37,140
you pointed out, many times, so,
but also,

1216
01:15:37,170 --> 01:15:40,800
but also for, for advertising
reasons. Because if you can see

1217
01:15:40,800 --> 01:15:43,800
what's in the audio, then you
know, what's being talked about,

1218
01:15:43,800 --> 01:15:46,830
and you can then target the
adverts much, much better. Now,

1219
01:15:46,860 --> 01:15:51,330
none of none of us might want
that. But on the other side,

1220
01:15:51,330 --> 01:15:54,300
actually, if that's going to
make the adverts slightly less

1221
01:15:54,300 --> 01:15:59,700
bad than that's probably a good
thing, too. Yeah. So I think so

1222
01:15:59,700 --> 01:16:02,610
I think there's real
opportunity. And it's also a

1223
01:16:02,610 --> 01:16:07,260
really simple thing for a
podcast host to support. You

1224
01:16:07,260 --> 01:16:12,150
know, it's it's a couple of
fields, and is available. I

1225
01:16:12,150 --> 01:16:14,610
mean, producing the transcript
is different producing the

1226
01:16:14,610 --> 01:16:18,420
transcript is complicated. But
to support just, you know,

1227
01:16:18,420 --> 01:16:21,690
here's here's a transcript file,
stick this somewhere on a server

1228
01:16:21,690 --> 01:16:25,350
and stick this in the RSS feed
is super, super simple. Well,

1229
01:16:26,100 --> 01:16:29,640
and so I think, you know, the
more of that the we can get, the

1230
01:16:29,640 --> 01:16:33,600
better. But I I certainly see as
podcast transcripts being, you

1231
01:16:33,600 --> 01:16:37,920
know, a real a real opportunity
to get into the majority of

1232
01:16:37,920 --> 01:16:40,320
podcast hosts, maybe in the next
three months.

1233
01:16:40,680 --> 01:16:47,070
Yeah. For me, for me, the most
important thing that I would

1234
01:16:47,100 --> 01:16:50,760
would love to see more
integration of his pod ping.

1235
01:16:51,990 --> 01:16:58,560
Yeah, I think once. Once pod
ping really takes off the power

1236
01:16:58,560 --> 01:17:04,140
of pod ping, it's so fun to say.
Because, you know, you can tap

1237
01:17:04,140 --> 01:17:08,370
into the chain for all kinds of
different shit. You know, it's

1238
01:17:08,370 --> 01:17:12,660
not just to get into podcast
index. I mean, holy crap. Even

1239
01:17:12,660 --> 01:17:15,690
if you're just aggregating
feeds, if you just want to have

1240
01:17:15,690 --> 01:17:19,140
feeds for yourself, you know, if
you just want to look at things

1241
01:17:19,140 --> 01:17:22,740
or learn something, or look at
trends, or, you know, and then

1242
01:17:22,890 --> 01:17:28,320
it's like a, it's like a burst
of, of data that spews out every

1243
01:17:28,320 --> 01:17:31,590
10 seconds, and oh, look, it's
got a tail and what's Oh, it's a

1244
01:17:31,590 --> 01:17:35,310
transcript attached to it. I
mean, if we're doing split

1245
01:17:35,310 --> 01:17:38,700
second, just to play that hat,
if we're doing split second

1246
01:17:38,700 --> 01:17:43,140
advertising, you know, auction
decisions, programmatically,

1247
01:17:43,320 --> 01:17:45,840
wouldn't you want that kind of
data data is always going to be

1248
01:17:45,840 --> 01:17:49,770
very valuable. So the more more
we put into pod ping, the more

1249
01:17:49,770 --> 01:17:52,470
valuable it is, and the more
valuable it is for everybody,

1250
01:17:52,470 --> 01:17:56,160
because that's something that
really no one owns.

1251
01:17:57,480 --> 01:18:00,450
Now, but I bet you can you can
kind of almost see the

1252
01:18:00,450 --> 01:18:03,390
differences here being podcast
transcript is something that

1253
01:18:03,390 --> 01:18:07,080
doesn't exist as a standard that
needs to exist because there's

1254
01:18:07,080 --> 01:18:10,710
real legal benefit for it to
exist quite apart from the

1255
01:18:10,710 --> 01:18:14,970
accessibility which is obviously
something which is which is

1256
01:18:14,970 --> 01:18:19,380
rather more important than then
conversations about legality

1257
01:18:20,490 --> 01:18:23,340
that that's on one side, you've
got pod ping on the other that

1258
01:18:23,340 --> 01:18:27,780
makes something that podcasting
already does a bit better. And

1259
01:18:27,780 --> 01:18:31,200
so I can well see that some
people are turning around and

1260
01:18:31,200 --> 01:18:33,270
saying well, we've just built
you know, I mean, Apple for

1261
01:18:33,270 --> 01:18:35,670
example, they've just built
their massive great big RSS

1262
01:18:35,910 --> 01:18:40,380
scraper that now touches my RSS
feed every five minutes or so.

1263
01:18:41,460 --> 01:18:45,600
And so why why would they want
to retool their their stuff

1264
01:18:45,600 --> 01:18:50,550
because it works well enough.
And you can kind of see though

1265
01:18:50,580 --> 01:18:55,500
those those two sort of
different issues one of them is

1266
01:18:55,620 --> 01:18:58,860
we haven't got this we need this
now. And the other side is we've

1267
01:18:58,860 --> 01:19:01,920
got this it's not quite good
enough, but it's probably good

1268
01:19:01,920 --> 01:19:04,500
enough for what we want at the
moment and we don't want to

1269
01:19:04,500 --> 01:19:09,690
spend the time or I think pod
ping is harder but I can I can

1270
01:19:09,690 --> 01:19:11,880
absolutely see this see the
benefit of it

1271
01:19:11,910 --> 01:19:18,360
I guess. I guess I see pod ping
is something it's so universal

1272
01:19:18,360 --> 01:19:24,570
it's it's such a fantastic idea
in its and you just have for me

1273
01:19:24,570 --> 01:19:28,560
it's like I pull my myself out
of podcasts index pull away from

1274
01:19:28,560 --> 01:19:35,550
the apps even Kier is a it's a
fire hose that spews out really

1275
01:19:35,550 --> 01:19:39,660
rich data every 10 seconds. And
it's it can be used for

1276
01:19:39,660 --> 01:19:43,740
entertainment for research for
so many different things. Now we

1277
01:19:43,740 --> 01:19:47,850
happen to sit on on one side
with podcast index, and we're

1278
01:19:47,850 --> 01:19:51,870
doing one function of that. So
just outside I mean, why

1279
01:19:51,870 --> 01:19:56,280
wouldn't musicians use this? You
know, hear it or? I mean this, I

1280
01:19:56,280 --> 01:19:59,670
can come up with a million
reasons. It just seems like a

1281
01:19:59,670 --> 01:20:03,360
signal mechanism there that
we've not had before. This

1282
01:20:03,360 --> 01:20:05,760
isn't, you know, this was web
blogs.com, which, by the way

1283
01:20:05,760 --> 01:20:09,870
sold for a million bucks. And a
long time ago, when a million

1284
01:20:09,870 --> 01:20:12,090
dollars was now a trillion.

1285
01:20:14,849 --> 01:20:18,299
I think there's a vision gap, I
think there's with it, this is

1286
01:20:18,299 --> 01:20:20,789
what I've seen with a lot of
these sort of forward looking

1287
01:20:20,819 --> 01:20:25,289
looking things that we have
going on, is that there's sort

1288
01:20:25,289 --> 01:20:29,819
of the immediate benefit that
everybody may see, but only some

1289
01:20:29,819 --> 01:20:32,789
may find compelling. So
something like pod paying would

1290
01:20:32,789 --> 01:20:36,089
be like, well, you can get
notified of episodes sooner.

1291
01:20:37,289 --> 01:20:40,409
Well, that's great. But that may
not, that's compelling to me,

1292
01:20:40,739 --> 01:20:42,989
and to a lot of people, but it
may not be compelling to

1293
01:20:42,989 --> 01:20:47,099
everyone. But then there's also
this long term vision where we

1294
01:20:47,099 --> 01:20:52,679
see that down the road,
something like live

1295
01:20:52,679 --> 01:20:57,749
notifications, or a podcast, or
this podcast feed has switched

1296
01:20:57,749 --> 01:21:00,899
from this host to this other
host movement, move

1297
01:21:00,899 --> 01:21:05,009
notifications, things like this
that are that are things that

1298
01:21:05,009 --> 01:21:08,519
are actually very, very
difficult to figure out. And

1299
01:21:08,519 --> 01:21:11,459
then it does become compelling.
So I think there's a gap in

1300
01:21:11,459 --> 01:21:15,689
vision here that takes it's like
when you're when you're the sort

1301
01:21:15,689 --> 01:21:21,689
of inventor or, or the the idea
behind you see the idea behind

1302
01:21:21,689 --> 01:21:25,589
it, like the podcasting 2.0
community does, you see it in

1303
01:21:25,589 --> 01:21:29,369
full, and it's really hard to
get everybody else onto that

1304
01:21:29,369 --> 01:21:33,569
page. So to me that just, but
what I see that has to happen in

1305
01:21:33,569 --> 01:21:37,229
situations like that, is we just
have to build the things. You

1306
01:21:37,229 --> 01:21:38,519
have to build a building.

1307
01:21:38,550 --> 01:21:41,880
Yeah, I mean, I think shows two
sides of that one, I found

1308
01:21:41,880 --> 01:21:47,850
writing the tech stuff section
every Monday is trying to

1309
01:21:47,850 --> 01:21:53,460
explain what's been going on in
the namespace to explain it to

1310
01:21:53,460 --> 01:21:55,860
somebody that isn't that
interested in it in the first

1311
01:21:55,860 --> 01:21:59,160
place. And that's been really
interesting. So actually

1312
01:21:59,160 --> 01:22:04,710
explaining why you might want
this the new podcast images tag,

1313
01:22:04,710 --> 01:22:08,640
for example, explaining what you
can do with that, that actually

1314
01:22:08,640 --> 01:22:13,770
below a certain size, you might
want to get rid of the lettering

1315
01:22:13,800 --> 01:22:17,940
from your, you know, artwork. So
it's just a nice, a nice icon,

1316
01:22:17,940 --> 01:22:20,850
whatever it whatever it might
be. And I think that that's

1317
01:22:20,850 --> 01:22:23,550
probably something that we
should focus on a little bit

1318
01:22:23,550 --> 01:22:28,890
more in 2022 is actually
explaining, I think there's, I

1319
01:22:28,890 --> 01:22:33,030
think probably the folks in
podcast, index dot social, are

1320
01:22:33,030 --> 01:22:38,130
too clever, too intelligent, and
have already assumed that

1321
01:22:38,130 --> 01:22:41,730
everybody else understands where
they're going and understands

1322
01:22:41,730 --> 01:22:44,760
what this stuff is capable off.
And I'm not sure that that's the

1323
01:22:44,760 --> 01:22:47,580
case. And I think it would be
good for us to focus a little

1324
01:22:47,580 --> 01:22:53,130
bit more on just writing down
what you could do with some of

1325
01:22:53,130 --> 01:22:57,870
this stuff, why this particular
tag is important. What why this,

1326
01:22:58,620 --> 01:23:00,990
you know, why you should be
implementing this particular

1327
01:23:00,990 --> 01:23:03,690
tag, because I think the more of
that the weakened due to

1328
01:23:03,690 --> 01:23:11,220
educate, then the faster the the
that podcast 2.0 will actually

1329
01:23:11,220 --> 01:23:12,030
get there. Well,

1330
01:23:12,540 --> 01:23:16,380
I think things like bringing in
the Peter wells of the world, is

1331
01:23:16,380 --> 01:23:16,950
that what you're saying?

1332
01:23:18,300 --> 01:23:23,040
I mean, whether or not whether
or not you Yeah, whether or not

1333
01:23:23,040 --> 01:23:25,800
you want to go that far, but I
think I think just you know,

1334
01:23:27,270 --> 01:23:33,480
just just just pointing to, you
know, this is the sort of thing

1335
01:23:33,480 --> 01:23:37,470
that you can do with this tag.
So this is what you can do with

1336
01:23:37,470 --> 01:23:39,600
this tag right now. And this is
the sort of thing that you could

1337
01:23:39,600 --> 01:23:43,860
do with this tag in the future.
And explaining those sorts of

1338
01:23:43,860 --> 01:23:46,620
things. So explaining the
alternate enclosure, for

1339
01:23:46,620 --> 01:23:50,790
example, or the alternate
enclosure tag could be a really

1340
01:23:50,790 --> 01:23:53,820
interesting tag which enables
you to do all kinds of things

1341
01:23:53,820 --> 01:23:57,930
from very low bitrate versions
for countries where data is

1342
01:23:57,930 --> 01:24:02,370
expensive to video versions
where you can just switch

1343
01:24:02,490 --> 01:24:07,470
automatically between the audio
and the video stream and you

1344
01:24:07,470 --> 01:24:09,840
know in your in your client or
whatever it is that you're

1345
01:24:09,840 --> 01:24:12,870
actually doing or a bunch of
other things as well you know, a

1346
01:24:12,870 --> 01:24:13,830
director's cut,

1347
01:24:14,400 --> 01:24:18,120
James James, what I like is that
you're so incredibly good at

1348
01:24:18,120 --> 01:24:21,210
that and I want you to continue
to write that you need to write

1349
01:24:21,210 --> 01:24:26,640
these things down. What works in
my mind is that's at one level

1350
01:24:26,640 --> 01:24:30,030
but you know even even highly
technical people when they see

1351
01:24:30,030 --> 01:24:33,630
heli pad they go oh crap now I
get it. Yeah,

1352
01:24:33,660 --> 01:24:39,240
we use pad is heavy pad is is
going to be super good when that

1353
01:24:39,240 --> 01:24:42,570
gets into the Umbral, you know,
App Store properly. That's so

1354
01:24:42,570 --> 01:24:46,710
so so you're both right, you're
both right. You're both right on

1355
01:24:46,710 --> 01:24:51,300
this. Now. I like showing
products. I like showing product

1356
01:24:51,300 --> 01:24:54,630
is a great product. It's an
outstanding product. Gentlemen,

1357
01:24:54,630 --> 01:24:58,830
shall we thank a few people and
then wrap this up so that

1358
01:24:59,430 --> 01:25:02,190
everybody can Get on with their
with their with their Christmas

1359
01:25:02,220 --> 01:25:03,210
celebrations.

1360
01:25:04,170 --> 01:25:04,950
Oh yes.

1361
01:25:05,730 --> 01:25:08,700
Let's think people next do that.
I hope you I hope that you got

1362
01:25:08,700 --> 01:25:10,770
my my booster Oh

1363
01:25:10,770 --> 01:25:12,060
I got it I got it

1364
01:25:12,060 --> 01:25:15,390
hold on a second dry roll out
the single yet Dave is a time.

1365
01:25:15,900 --> 01:25:16,320
Well,

1366
01:25:16,590 --> 01:25:22,620
we can we can start with James
cuz he he bet us he bet you a

1367
01:25:22,620 --> 01:25:24,840
million dollars. Hold on

1368
01:25:25,920 --> 01:25:30,840
shot Carla 20 blades. Oh man
Paula Yes.

1369
01:25:31,590 --> 01:25:36,060
James bet you a million dollars.
Yeah, that and I have I have

1370
01:25:36,060 --> 01:25:42,000
audio proof of this. It is
Cridland bet. Jingle

1371
01:25:42,210 --> 01:25:45,930
Oh, you have you have you
brought it holy crap. Oh, I

1372
01:25:45,930 --> 01:25:47,760
didn't realize you actually.
Okay, here.

1373
01:25:47,790 --> 01:25:51,540
This is record. This is a
recording of James at the very

1374
01:25:51,540 --> 01:25:53,550
tail end saying how much he's
going to bet

1375
01:25:53,610 --> 01:25:57,990
a million dollar. Yeah, you're
right. I remember that. I

1376
01:25:57,990 --> 01:26:01,860
remember exactly that on the
episode. 1 million. Now the

1377
01:26:01,890 --> 01:26:08,040
unfortunately it was in that is
in a Bitcoin value in 10 years.

1378
01:26:08,040 --> 01:26:10,620
So he's giving me the discounted
rate, I believe.

1379
01:26:11,040 --> 01:26:13,140
Oh, I thought it was a million
Australian dollars.

1380
01:26:15,870 --> 01:26:18,030
That's about two, what was the
Betty? What was the bed about

1381
01:26:18,030 --> 01:26:18,690
James?

1382
01:26:19,410 --> 01:26:22,650
So the bet was that Apple
podcasts would launch Apple

1383
01:26:22,650 --> 01:26:26,700
podcasts on Android by the end
of 2021. Because they're not

1384
01:26:26,700 --> 01:26:29,520
stupid. And it turns out that
they are stupid.

1385
01:26:30,450 --> 01:26:33,690
Now, why have you given up
before the end of the year? I

1386
01:26:33,690 --> 01:26:35,730
mean, that couldn't wait one
more thing?

1387
01:26:36,180 --> 01:26:39,780
Because I I would doubt that
Apple are going to launch

1388
01:26:39,780 --> 01:26:44,910
something that big. I mean, you
know, I mean, the BBC launched

1389
01:26:44,910 --> 01:26:48,450
the BBC iPlayer on Christmas
Day. So you never know. I mean,

1390
01:26:48,450 --> 01:26:51,810
it could it could happen. But I
think no, I'm not. I'm not so

1391
01:26:51,810 --> 01:26:55,980
sure. So yeah, I am absolutely
convinced, by the way that they

1392
01:26:55,980 --> 01:26:59,940
are going to do it. And I'm
convinced that in probably next

1393
01:26:59,940 --> 01:27:01,860
year, would you like to double
down?

1394
01:27:02,309 --> 01:27:05,399
Let me read the note. Let me
read the note as Jane and James

1395
01:27:05,399 --> 01:27:08,639
Cridland through the fountain
apps in 100,000 SATs.

1396
01:27:08,850 --> 01:27:12,330
That is the correct amount. That
is what the bet was? Yes. And he

1397
01:27:12,330 --> 01:27:12,630
says

1398
01:27:12,660 --> 01:27:16,140
so you were right. No Apple
podcasts on Android in 2021.

1399
01:27:16,260 --> 01:27:19,050
Same bed again for 2022. Ah,

1400
01:27:19,320 --> 01:27:25,410
well before we discussed that.
You posted a you posted a

1401
01:27:25,410 --> 01:27:33,510
picture on podcast index dot
social of of your transfer. And

1402
01:27:33,900 --> 01:27:37,620
what was very disappointing
James is I saw that the per

1403
01:27:37,620 --> 01:27:43,260
minute value you have
podcasting. 2.0 is three sets

1404
01:27:43,260 --> 01:27:43,950
per minute.

1405
01:27:44,610 --> 01:27:47,310
You outed yourself as a
cheapskate I mean, you are

1406
01:27:47,310 --> 01:27:47,850
perhaps

1407
01:27:47,850 --> 01:27:51,570
the cheapest, cheapest
journalist I've ever met in my

1408
01:27:51,570 --> 01:27:56,280
entire life. I mean, do you
really get that little from this

1409
01:27:56,280 --> 01:27:56,820
show?

1410
01:27:58,350 --> 01:28:04,320
To be honest, I've got no idea.
Why is that at that level? What

1411
01:28:04,320 --> 01:28:06,510
level should it be set at Adam
curry

1412
01:28:06,750 --> 01:28:08,940
mindset at 100? I think that's

1413
01:28:09,540 --> 01:28:13,110
okay, too. Okay, for those of us
for those of us that aren't, you

1414
01:28:13,110 --> 01:28:16,740
know, for those of us that
didn't spend billions of dollars

1415
01:28:16,740 --> 01:28:22,410
in the 1990s on on on a
helicopter fuel? What would be

1416
01:28:22,950 --> 01:28:27,660
be that sensible? Number of
sets? 100?

1417
01:28:29,250 --> 01:28:31,710
Yeah, what do you say? What do
you have Dave? 33

1418
01:28:31,860 --> 01:28:36,060
None man set at 50 Typically,
but then on on the down jacket

1419
01:28:36,330 --> 01:28:37,290
100 For

1420
01:28:37,320 --> 01:28:41,070
podcasts live but you but you
you boost extraordinary amounts.

1421
01:28:41,610 --> 01:28:44,700
I do it. This is the beauty of
it. Everyone can set it to what

1422
01:28:44,700 --> 01:28:47,790
they want. And I just presume
that day really is like you see,

1423
01:28:47,790 --> 01:28:51,060
nobody should show you know,
well, I've seen those three sets

1424
01:28:51,060 --> 01:28:53,160
come in. So I know you're
listening.

1425
01:28:54,000 --> 01:28:57,600
But nobody, but nobody knows
what other people have set them

1426
01:28:57,600 --> 01:28:58,710
to. That's the thing.

1427
01:28:58,980 --> 01:29:03,930
Yeah, but you've doxxed yourself
in the worst possible way. You

1428
01:29:04,710 --> 01:29:07,350
know, I know. Yeah, you should
do. Everyone should have it.

1429
01:29:07,410 --> 01:29:10,080
Like I'm gonna set mine to a
custom number. I'm gonna set it

1430
01:29:10,080 --> 01:29:14,460
to 67 now, because that is a
number. Yeah, that's the number

1431
01:29:14,460 --> 01:29:16,620
of this Everyone knows that.
It's me that's listening.

1432
01:29:17,219 --> 01:29:20,459
By the way, James you referred
to I think it was on pod land.

1433
01:29:20,459 --> 01:29:23,879
You referred to the podcasting
2.0 community as the task force,

1434
01:29:24,389 --> 01:29:28,319
I guess in 2.0 Task Force. I
forgotten that. I actually

1435
01:29:28,649 --> 01:29:31,079
prefer this the the term strike
team

1436
01:29:33,540 --> 01:29:35,280
that means something very
different in France.

1437
01:29:38,310 --> 01:29:40,530
Okay, let's see who we got. Oh,

1438
01:29:40,530 --> 01:29:43,590
wait, so are we doubling down
you want to do a another for

1439
01:29:43,590 --> 01:29:44,550
next year James?

1440
01:29:45,360 --> 01:29:48,930
Oh, we couldn't we can we can.
Yeah, we can do that. Again for

1441
01:29:48,930 --> 01:29:51,120
next year. If you like what does
doubling down mean? Does that

1442
01:29:51,120 --> 01:29:53,040
mean? I'm not a betting man.
Does that mean does that mean?

1443
01:29:53,040 --> 01:29:53,850
It's now 200

1444
01:29:53,880 --> 01:30:00,660
You're going to lose twice as
much is what that means? I think

1445
01:30:00,690 --> 01:30:04,530
let's, let's let's in at the end
of next year, Dave, you'll be

1446
01:30:04,530 --> 01:30:08,670
our witness. I think we did
100,000 SATs I think cuz I

1447
01:30:08,670 --> 01:30:11,250
reserve this amount. I think we
should do a million SATs.

1448
01:30:12,150 --> 01:30:15,030
Whoa, what even is a million set

1449
01:30:15,060 --> 01:30:20,520
today? 400 bucks.

1450
01:30:20,760 --> 01:30:24,120
That's right. That's a that's a
bad one that makes you do it. It

1451
01:30:24,120 --> 01:30:27,030
says What if What if bitcoin
goes to 200,000? Then Then

1452
01:30:27,030 --> 01:30:28,170
you're gonna go? No,

1453
01:30:28,200 --> 01:30:31,560
I'll be. I'll be I'll be
extremely happy that I made my

1454
01:30:31,560 --> 01:30:35,040
friend James Cridland know if he
wins, I'd be very happy but

1455
01:30:35,040 --> 01:30:38,190
like, holy crap, man. I'm giving
you a million SATs. That was 400

1456
01:30:38,190 --> 01:30:41,730
bucks now it's 40,000.
Congratulations. I just paid for

1457
01:30:41,730 --> 01:30:43,740
your extension. We're gonna

1458
01:30:43,740 --> 01:30:50,340
do 200,000 sets. Okay. 200,000
sets shaves. You say Holy crap.

1459
01:30:50,580 --> 01:30:53,610
I've already signed my name is
done. You can tell them as a way

1460
01:30:53,610 --> 01:30:57,090
to tell you so those kids in the
house so Okay, yeah. If anybody

1461
01:30:57,090 --> 01:30:57,270
from

1462
01:30:57,270 --> 01:30:59,520
Apple is listening, and they
wouldn't mind giving me a little

1463
01:30:59,520 --> 01:31:04,980
bit of emojis would be good if
anybody was listening. Thanks,

1464
01:31:04,980 --> 01:31:08,670
James. Your your your stand up
guy. I appreciate you. Coming

1465
01:31:08,670 --> 01:31:09,480
through on that bet.

1466
01:31:11,550 --> 01:31:16,830
John Shijie sent us 2000 sets
and he's from CAST ematic and he

1467
01:31:16,830 --> 01:31:20,160
says boosting from CAST ematic
whilst I'm writing an article

1468
01:31:20,160 --> 01:31:23,820
about boosting from CAST ematic
Love Your Work guys keep it up.

1469
01:31:24,750 --> 01:31:32,220
Boost boost that one cracks me
up okay at some of that didn't I

1470
01:31:32,220 --> 01:31:34,590
did not print out all of these
so I'm actually reading them off

1471
01:31:34,590 --> 01:31:39,360
the screen which gives me the
crave but today oh rush boost.

1472
01:31:39,960 --> 01:31:44,370
From Harry pilgrims through
breeze app. He sent 2112 And he

1473
01:31:44,370 --> 01:31:47,580
says if you choose not to decide
you still have made a choice

1474
01:31:47,580 --> 01:31:50,760
free will boost from Harry
pilgrim that those are lyrics

1475
01:31:50,790 --> 01:31:52,110
from a rush song. Ooh,

1476
01:31:52,140 --> 01:31:53,430
by the way, very nice.

1477
01:31:55,950 --> 01:32:00,360
See, sir Spencer gave us 12,345
SATs.

1478
01:32:00,390 --> 01:32:01,680
Ooh, nice.

1479
01:32:01,889 --> 01:32:04,679
Yeah through fountain and he
says it's busy times for

1480
01:32:04,679 --> 01:32:07,949
podcasting 2.0 stuff. We now
have a working raspy blitz

1481
01:32:07,979 --> 01:32:11,939
installation script for Dave's
heli pad app. Hey, nice. Thanks

1482
01:32:11,939 --> 01:32:16,199
to the help testing and fixing
from C Dubs and Abel Kirby and I

1483
01:32:16,199 --> 01:32:19,379
are launching our value for
value album in one week on

1484
01:32:19,379 --> 01:32:20,249
Christmas Eve

1485
01:32:20,280 --> 01:32:24,660
Yeah, this thing is going to be
they've some screenshots of the

1486
01:32:24,660 --> 01:32:27,810
mixer the mix down whatever
they're doing, and it's gonna be

1487
01:32:27,810 --> 01:32:31,860
like a million trillion
gigabytes of shit. I can't wait.

1488
01:32:32,610 --> 01:32:35,310
I can't wait. I'll be boosting
that one man.

1489
01:32:36,090 --> 01:32:38,910
Just waiting for those medium
and live tags to drop and then

1490
01:32:38,910 --> 01:32:42,150
we can water SE and then the
water will really be churning.

1491
01:32:42,150 --> 01:32:43,110
Go podcasting.

1492
01:32:43,140 --> 01:32:45,900
Yes. Oh, yeah. Where's my
jingle?

1493
01:32:48,150 --> 01:32:52,800
James, do you have any interest
whatsoever in the live tag?

1494
01:32:55,620 --> 01:32:59,910
Me personally, I'm not sure that
I do because I know full well.

1495
01:32:59,940 --> 01:33:02,640
Every LIVE TAG is going to be
live at three o'clock in the

1496
01:33:02,640 --> 01:33:09,180
morning. Yes, thanks. Australian
timezones. But, but I can see

1497
01:33:09,180 --> 01:33:12,060
it, I can see it being useful.
You know, I mean, there are some

1498
01:33:12,060 --> 01:33:14,430
times when I'm up and I would
like to see you to watch for

1499
01:33:14,430 --> 01:33:18,360
example, the new media show so I
can tell Todd and Rob when I

1500
01:33:18,360 --> 01:33:22,140
think so. Yeah. Yeah, I can see
that.

1501
01:33:23,190 --> 01:33:28,800
Chad Pharaoh's and his 3333 sets
through fountain he says Thanks

1502
01:33:28,800 --> 01:33:31,380
for the kind words. Well, you're
welcome. Very nice.

1503
01:33:31,380 --> 01:33:33,480
Thank you, man. Always there.

1504
01:33:33,870 --> 01:33:40,080
Yep. Oh, Harry Duran from
podcast junkies. Huh. He's he

1505
01:33:40,080 --> 01:33:45,360
found he sent us out through
1111 SATs through fountain he

1506
01:33:45,360 --> 01:33:48,150
says I can't think of a more
perfect example of value for

1507
01:33:48,150 --> 01:33:51,870
value than this explanation of
the 4.6 million podcasts in a

1508
01:33:51,870 --> 01:33:54,390
way that makes sense. Yeah, up
the great work. Dave and Adam

1509
01:33:54,510 --> 01:33:55,770
curry from podcast junkies

1510
01:33:56,190 --> 01:33:58,560
was a dynamite explanation
boost.

1511
01:33:59,400 --> 01:34:04,140
Yeah, he has got so behind value
for value as well. Harry, he's,

1512
01:34:04,410 --> 01:34:07,110
he's a great guy. I've met him a
number of times. He's just got

1513
01:34:07,110 --> 01:34:09,840
so behind it. So really, really
good to see him getting there.

1514
01:34:10,320 --> 01:34:12,960
Yes, I was hearing him. He
intros his show with a two.

1515
01:34:12,990 --> 01:34:19,050
Yeah, he's in there. Chad Farrow
again. Give us 3333 sets and he

1516
01:34:19,050 --> 01:34:23,280
says love the JCD boost boost
boost jingle boost boost boost.

1517
01:34:24,930 --> 01:34:28,170
I tricked him into doing that.
Did you kind of

1518
01:34:29,700 --> 01:34:34,980
you egged him on until he broke
he doesn't know. Let's see Harry

1519
01:34:34,980 --> 01:34:41,130
Duran again. Repeat customer
3333 sets and he says just got

1520
01:34:41,130 --> 01:34:44,250
inspired by the bus jingle.
Hopefully this is enough to ask

1521
01:34:44,250 --> 01:34:47,760
Adam to invent a promo for
podcast junkies on the spot. Go

1522
01:34:47,760 --> 01:34:52,470
podcasting. Ooh. If you listen
to podcast junkies, no,

1523
01:34:52,470 --> 01:34:55,560
I think I think Wait, hang on.
I've been on podcast junk. I

1524
01:34:55,560 --> 01:34:57,630
think I have to listen to it
before I can do that before I

1525
01:34:57,630 --> 01:35:00,660
can do a jingle. Okay, all
right. Well I need I need some

1526
01:35:00,660 --> 01:35:03,960
creative direction. Could you
guys boost us some creative

1527
01:35:03,960 --> 01:35:04,590
direction?

1528
01:35:05,040 --> 01:35:08,490
Yes. Yes, that needs to we will
return to this.

1529
01:35:08,520 --> 01:35:11,940
Yes, I want to do that. But you
know, people are asking for this

1530
01:35:11,940 --> 01:35:16,140
now and, you know, it's all
gonna sound the same. If I just

1531
01:35:16,140 --> 01:35:16,920
do it on the fly.

1532
01:35:17,670 --> 01:35:21,870
Yeah, I will bring actually had
a clip of Harry Duran and I'll

1533
01:35:21,870 --> 01:35:23,340
bring that next time. Good

1534
01:35:23,490 --> 01:35:25,680
guy wants some creative
direction from them to some

1535
01:35:25,680 --> 01:35:28,890
input. All right. This is kind
of like a podcast version of

1536
01:35:28,890 --> 01:35:31,860
cameo. Cameo app.

1537
01:35:33,030 --> 01:35:34,650
I don't I don't know what candy
Oh, well.

1538
01:35:34,650 --> 01:35:38,340
You can pay like $1,000 and
Snoop Dogg will do a video

1539
01:35:38,340 --> 01:35:41,520
message for you. Okay, they
tried to get me to do that

1540
01:35:41,520 --> 01:35:43,500
several times. Like now I won't
do that.

1541
01:35:43,889 --> 01:35:47,069
When you first set it. The thing
I envisioned in my head was the

1542
01:35:47,069 --> 01:35:49,319
masked singer. That stupid show.

1543
01:35:50,370 --> 01:35:52,800
Oh, goodness, the masking Yeah,
the masking.

1544
01:35:53,640 --> 01:35:56,640
I was thinking about what up was
yeah, that's with

1545
01:35:57,540 --> 01:36:00,540
the car. Yeah, that's what I
thought of the red pants

1546
01:36:00,570 --> 01:36:01,710
codpiece. Right

1547
01:36:01,710 --> 01:36:03,510
right up there alongside bucks
phase.

1548
01:36:03,570 --> 01:36:06,690
Yeah, that's why we know so
well. Yeah.

1549
01:36:06,870 --> 01:36:10,950
Was the shot shocks. Some was it
other band you referenced?

1550
01:36:11,490 --> 01:36:14,070
shock? Shock this something

1551
01:36:15,210 --> 01:36:16,680
that happened Demas and pliers.

1552
01:36:17,910 --> 01:36:25,260
That's it. That's it. Chicago.
Yeah. 49 see, John's BRT gave us

1553
01:36:25,260 --> 01:36:30,090
4949 sets the the fountain app
una says recently went over a

1554
01:36:30,090 --> 01:36:33,390
million Sasa support using the
fountain app, go podcasting.

1555
01:36:33,420 --> 01:36:37,890
Beautiful. I say go John's BRT.

1556
01:36:38,130 --> 01:36:39,000
Yeah, real.

1557
01:36:39,690 --> 01:36:46,860
Thank you, man. Peter gave us
3333 sets in his messages. Pew

1558
01:36:46,860 --> 01:36:47,370
pew.

1559
01:36:47,790 --> 01:36:52,440
Oh, hold on a second. I don't I
don't have that one handy, but

1560
01:36:52,440 --> 01:36:55,950
it is like what I should because
it's the official sound of the

1561
01:36:55,950 --> 01:36:58,680
helipad. It needs to go into
Rotation here.

1562
01:36:59,580 --> 01:37:04,440
It was It cracked me up when in
right now. Luke from from the

1563
01:37:04,440 --> 01:37:07,380
Umbral it was we're chatting on
telegram and the pew pew hit and

1564
01:37:07,380 --> 01:37:08,220
he was like whoa,

1565
01:37:09,120 --> 01:37:11,160
what the hell? That thing's
really cool man.

1566
01:37:12,840 --> 01:37:16,620
Cast pillon gave us 33 SATs
through the fountain app and he

1567
01:37:16,620 --> 01:37:20,550
says boost Chris Fisher. Oh
yeah. Yep. Chris is the guy that

1568
01:37:20,730 --> 01:37:22,770
from Kota radio and Jupiter
broadcasting.

1569
01:37:24,990 --> 01:37:26,790
Okay, have it in the system now.
Pew.

1570
01:37:27,300 --> 01:37:32,670
Nice setup. CASS gave us another
33 SATs it says boost Chris.

1571
01:37:32,880 --> 01:37:34,890
Okay. Boosts Yeah, we can do
that.

1572
01:37:35,400 --> 01:37:41,850
Boost. See 2000 SATs front. Ooh,
this is Anonymous. Anonymous

1573
01:37:41,850 --> 01:37:45,270
through breeze. Add to that 1000
says I don't understand this

1574
01:37:45,270 --> 01:37:51,600
message. It's just says based
period. Or if you're British,

1575
01:37:51,780 --> 01:38:00,270
full stop. Did I get that right?
Is it full of sounds? That

1576
01:38:00,270 --> 01:38:03,120
was excellent. Excellent
punctuation there. Yes. Very

1577
01:38:03,120 --> 01:38:03,270
good.

1578
01:38:03,300 --> 01:38:06,570
Thank you. All right. I mean, I
am asking the vendors of it. You

1579
01:38:06,570 --> 01:38:07,800
know, the English language by

1580
01:38:07,800 --> 01:38:12,450
the way. I should. I should also
say that Dave, Dave Jackson got

1581
01:38:12,450 --> 01:38:15,510
in touch with me and said where
are all of these boosts jingles.

1582
01:38:15,870 --> 01:38:17,940
And they are available on
GitHub, but they're not on the

1583
01:38:17,940 --> 01:38:20,310
podcast index. GitHub. Are
there. Is there a child? Is

1584
01:38:20,310 --> 01:38:21,900
there a chance of getting them
in there as well?

1585
01:38:22,890 --> 01:38:25,530
Yeah, we could. We could fork
that over. Yeah, sure. Huh.

1586
01:38:26,100 --> 01:38:28,350
I think that'd be handy because
nobody can find them. And I'm

1587
01:38:28,350 --> 01:38:31,440
there. I'm there. Finally. Yeah,
I covered it. Always.

1588
01:38:31,620 --> 01:38:35,460
Always have a link in the show
notes. Every single show notes.

1589
01:38:35,670 --> 01:38:40,980
Episode has a link to the boost
bait. And that's that's the

1590
01:38:40,980 --> 01:38:42,600
direct link. Yeah,

1591
01:38:42,690 --> 01:38:49,890
yeah. I'm making a note to fork
that over. And let's see. Uh,

1592
01:38:49,890 --> 01:38:51,960
last month Oh, here it is. Oh,
Mere Mortals.

1593
01:38:51,990 --> 01:38:54,330
This is a productive board
meeting. Oh, yeah.

1594
01:38:54,360 --> 01:38:58,860
It is. what it's all about. It's
this is the part we love.

1595
01:38:59,220 --> 01:39:07,350
Yes. Mere Mortals. Karen. He
gave us 11,234 SAS sorry,

1596
01:39:07,950 --> 01:39:12,690
students 35 sets to fountain he
says wow the video playing on

1597
01:39:12,690 --> 01:39:16,410
podcast guru was amazing very
very cool. I created a clips

1598
01:39:16,410 --> 01:39:20,040
channel searchable under mere
mortals three speak and it works

1599
01:39:20,040 --> 01:39:23,520
perfectly there. Merry Christmas
to all of podcasting 2.0

1600
01:39:23,610 --> 01:39:25,560
Ah, Merry Christmas to you

1601
01:39:28,260 --> 01:39:32,070
such good guys. Oh I do want to
make before we get out of here

1602
01:39:32,070 --> 01:39:34,920
do you want to make fun of NF
T's real quick after we finish

1603
01:39:34,920 --> 01:39:35,160
this

1604
01:39:35,280 --> 01:39:38,070
no I want to leave on a high
note I want to I want it to be a

1605
01:39:38,070 --> 01:39:39,930
good ending. Let's be positive
Dave

1606
01:39:39,960 --> 01:39:43,980
positive. I'm making fun of
Venus teases hilarious

1607
01:39:45,240 --> 01:39:48,270
no because all right just
pollutes the timeline comics you

1608
01:39:48,270 --> 01:39:51,810
bloggers gonna post and he's
gonna tell us we're stupid.

1609
01:39:52,769 --> 01:39:57,119
make a joke about it about you
getting no flipping thing? Yes.

1610
01:39:58,890 --> 01:40:01,680
He'll do a car too. It's not
worth the aggro.

1611
01:40:02,160 --> 01:40:06,810
Okay, fine. We'll make fun of it
next week. There you go. Cast

1612
01:40:06,810 --> 01:40:11,940
Pilant. Again 3267. SAS the the
fountain app and he says, Love

1613
01:40:11,940 --> 01:40:17,400
to test IPFS stuff. Yeah, I'm on
IPFS since 2016 When BT sync,

1614
01:40:18,090 --> 01:40:26,100
left no agenda check out Open.
Open hooft.nl o n o ofd.

1615
01:40:26,189 --> 01:40:30,929
Yeah. Open host means open head
for some reason. Open hoeft dot

1616
01:40:31,769 --> 01:40:35,159
open hosts open Host. Yeah.
Interesting. Yeah, I know who he

1617
01:40:35,159 --> 01:40:39,899
is. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm
looking forward to some IPFS in

1618
01:40:39,899 --> 01:40:41,429
the in the coming years. Well,

1619
01:40:42,419 --> 01:40:50,849
yeah, me too. Oh, 5555 sets. I
get that a sack of fives. I

1620
01:40:50,849 --> 01:40:54,659
don't know what what's special
about the 5555. That's the

1621
01:40:54,659 --> 01:40:59,849
breeze and Satoshi string. Oh,
this may be from Satoshi stream,

1622
01:41:00,269 --> 01:41:04,049
says Satoshi stream now used by
250 podcasts.

1623
01:41:04,080 --> 01:41:07,020
Ooh. dynamize. That stream. Did
you go?

1624
01:41:07,559 --> 01:41:12,359
That's a good stat. And Brian
mozzie. Is that right? Brian?

1625
01:41:12,449 --> 01:41:17,249
Yeah, that's Brian. He sent us
11,722 SATs through fountain. He

1626
01:41:17,249 --> 01:41:20,669
says Same reason I'm always
boosting lately. New timestamp.

1627
01:41:20,939 --> 01:41:26,969
One hour, 17 minutes and 22
seconds. I don't know what that

1628
01:41:26,969 --> 01:41:33,509
is to look it up. I came on
prepared for this. Okay, so la

1629
01:41:33,509 --> 01:41:38,759
nomics. Oh, that's the under the
bus jingle that you did. 16 is a

1630
01:41:38,759 --> 01:41:42,929
1666. SAS the fountain. He says,
Hey, Adam and Dave, thanks for

1631
01:41:42,929 --> 01:41:43,949
the under the bus jingle.

1632
01:41:44,070 --> 01:41:45,420
You're relevant. Yeah, we

1633
01:41:45,420 --> 01:41:46,830
said we love it. Thank you.
Well, thank

1634
01:41:46,830 --> 01:41:50,760
you for the tip. You didn't have
to thank me for that. You

1635
01:41:50,760 --> 01:41:52,380
already paid with a boost
previously?

1636
01:41:52,620 --> 01:41:57,690
That's true. He paid in events.
Yeah, we wanted. Okay, we wanted

1637
01:41:57,690 --> 01:42:01,050
a Dutch cockney accent that
maybe that would have been too

1638
01:42:01,050 --> 01:42:03,480
much. Dutch cockney.

1639
01:42:03,540 --> 01:42:04,590
I don't think I can do that.

1640
01:42:05,250 --> 01:42:06,450
What is it? Is that a thing?

1641
01:42:06,719 --> 01:42:10,379
I know I don't think this is
James and I had a love child

1642
01:42:10,409 --> 01:42:12,539
then maybe we could check that
but

1643
01:42:13,980 --> 01:42:17,610
James, do you have what would be
considered a Cockney accent? No.

1644
01:42:17,820 --> 01:42:22,230
I have a very boring BBC
received pronunciation is what

1645
01:42:22,230 --> 01:42:23,850
is called. Yes, I'm afraid.

1646
01:42:24,269 --> 01:42:26,729
No. Okay. Well, I mean, I don't
know what an example of a

1647
01:42:26,729 --> 01:42:30,119
Cockney accent would be but I
can find it

1648
01:42:30,120 --> 01:42:33,480
is cool. Blimey cough. Have you
watched Mary Poppins?

1649
01:42:34,560 --> 01:42:37,950
Gotcha. Gotcha. Gotcha. Okay,
yeah, that's basically it. How

1650
01:42:37,950 --> 01:42:40,740
would you how you would How
would you possibly merge that

1651
01:42:40,740 --> 01:42:43,920
with a Dutch accent? I have no
idea that this is impossible.

1652
01:42:44,940 --> 01:42:47,970
Accounting, I sent you an
anonymous 5k Set boost from

1653
01:42:47,970 --> 01:42:51,570
breeze a further 1666 from
fountain to reach the 10,000

1654
01:42:51,570 --> 01:42:54,990
total Mark notice just had to
figure out how to split the

1655
01:42:54,990 --> 01:42:59,940
bill. No, not figure out the
split bit. That's what he said.

1656
01:43:00,300 --> 01:43:02,850
This proves beyond doubt
podcasting podcasting. 2.0

1657
01:43:02,850 --> 01:43:04,920
works. Happy Christmas. Erin.

1658
01:43:10,170 --> 01:43:13,380
Airy Duran follows it up with
another one a second ones? And

1659
01:43:13,380 --> 01:43:16,350
he says, heard you mentioned
James as next week's guest.

1660
01:43:16,440 --> 01:43:19,800
Well, it's this week's guest
actually, imagine if hosts a

1661
01:43:20,190 --> 01:43:23,550
vote. Want to ask James a
question. Who's now read out the

1662
01:43:23,550 --> 01:43:27,960
highest boosts first Andy How
you doing booster? Exactly. Mind

1663
01:43:27,960 --> 01:43:35,790
blown Harry from podcast junkies
echo. Yep. See, I think we had a

1664
01:43:37,170 --> 01:43:43,740
PAL is well, or thought we did
think we had good. Oh, yeah,

1665
01:43:43,770 --> 01:43:47,220
yeah, we did. We got some we got
a couple months here is a short

1666
01:43:47,220 --> 01:43:50,310
is short time period. So we
didn't have much, but we get an

1667
01:43:50,310 --> 01:43:57,930
anonymous $25 PayPal. Thank you
anonymous survey of ash gave us

1668
01:43:57,930 --> 01:44:02,700
$5 Keith gifts and gave us $25
Thank you, Keith, you rock

1669
01:44:02,700 --> 01:44:06,150
steady every month. I appreciate
it. Duane Goldie gave us $8 And

1670
01:44:06,150 --> 01:44:09,630
Paul Erskine gave us $11.14

1671
01:44:09,690 --> 01:44:14,970
And we thank everybody for
supporting podcasting 2.0 the

1672
01:44:14,970 --> 01:44:19,500
podcast but the entire project
it goes straight into liquidity

1673
01:44:19,500 --> 01:44:24,180
for the node it goes into. Well,
of course part of it goes to t

1674
01:44:24,180 --> 01:44:28,560
shirt T shirts. We we all do
like the T shirts. But it really

1675
01:44:28,560 --> 01:44:31,530
keeps the infrastructure running
and We highly appreciate it go

1676
01:44:31,530 --> 01:44:34,650
to podcast index.org. At the
bottom there's a Donate button

1677
01:44:34,650 --> 01:44:38,760
where we finally have I think a
service we can get a QR code to

1678
01:44:38,760 --> 01:44:44,880
scan for one off donations. But
above all, if you can boost we

1679
01:44:44,880 --> 01:44:50,700
want to get your boost, boost
boost and a portion of today's

1680
01:44:50,700 --> 01:44:56,100
show we'll also go to our guest
James Cridland. We will assign a

1681
01:44:56,100 --> 01:45:01,230
33% splits and said you know you
were definitely third, a third

1682
01:45:01,230 --> 01:45:03,960
of the whole system here. Yeah,
we really appreciate it. And

1683
01:45:03,960 --> 01:45:07,290
thanks for a great year. James,
I look forward to oh, there's my

1684
01:45:07,290 --> 01:45:11,160
dinner ready. Look forward to
all of the trouble we're going

1685
01:45:11,160 --> 01:45:13,200
to get into and all the
arguments and good things that

1686
01:45:13,200 --> 01:45:14,730
will come out of the coming
year.

1687
01:45:15,240 --> 01:45:18,510
Yeah, I look forward to it, too.
Thank you so much for everything

1688
01:45:18,510 --> 01:45:21,870
that you've done for podcasting,
both in the dim and distant past

1689
01:45:21,870 --> 01:45:25,560
and over the last year as well.
So thank you. Thank you very

1690
01:45:25,560 --> 01:45:25,950
much.

1691
01:45:26,010 --> 01:45:28,620
That was yeah, that was great.
Thanks, James. I appreciate it.

1692
01:45:28,620 --> 01:45:30,510
Well, I'm looking forward to
this. You know, I'm looking

1693
01:45:30,510 --> 01:45:34,470
forward to the next year. And
what what's one thing that you

1694
01:45:34,470 --> 01:45:37,470
think just kind of lead us out a
little bit? What is one thing

1695
01:45:37,470 --> 01:45:41,280
that you think that you are the
most excited about as far as

1696
01:45:41,670 --> 01:45:44,460
anything to do with the
namespace or podcasting to put

1697
01:45:44,460 --> 01:45:47,490
out? What's your big, what's
your big hope for 2022?

1698
01:45:47,850 --> 01:45:50,130
I think I've got a couple. I
think one of the big hopes is

1699
01:45:50,130 --> 01:45:53,940
that the podcast transcript tag
is pretty well, universally

1700
01:45:53,940 --> 01:45:59,220
token taken up, it'll be good
for creators, because we would

1701
01:45:59,220 --> 01:46:03,300
be able to control what our
transcript said, but also good

1702
01:46:03,300 --> 01:46:05,460
for, you know, good for
everybody good for

1703
01:46:05,460 --> 01:46:08,460
accessibility, good for podcast
apps, everything else. So I

1704
01:46:08,460 --> 01:46:11,820
think that that would be, that's
the kind of the low hanging

1705
01:46:11,820 --> 01:46:16,890
fruit. And I would hope that
more people, one of the things

1706
01:46:16,890 --> 01:46:20,490
that concerns me a little bit
about booster grams and value

1707
01:46:20,490 --> 01:46:25,620
for value is that there are some
people who are using it. But it

1708
01:46:25,620 --> 01:46:29,130
doesn't necessarily feel to me
as if it's growing that much.

1709
01:46:29,220 --> 01:46:34,020
And it doesn't necessarily feel
to me as if it's breaking

1710
01:46:34,020 --> 01:46:39,390
through to new people that
aren't already into this sort of

1711
01:46:39,390 --> 01:46:44,100
things. So I would really like
to see much more of that in

1712
01:46:44,460 --> 01:46:49,260
2022, of actually, you know,
seeing different names in the

1713
01:46:49,260 --> 01:46:54,180
histogram list of seeing more
people being involved. And I

1714
01:46:54,180 --> 01:46:58,680
think, you know, helping as many
podcasts be into, you know,

1715
01:46:58,680 --> 01:47:01,680
value for value is, I think, a
really good thing. And that goes

1716
01:47:01,680 --> 01:47:05,790
for both the technical side, but
I think it also goes for the,

1717
01:47:06,090 --> 01:47:10,380
you know, just the, the sight of
well, what is it that you say in

1718
01:47:10,380 --> 01:47:14,550
your podcast? Should you do a
boost gram corner, the reason I

1719
01:47:14,550 --> 01:47:17,670
do a booster gram corner is that
I know social proof that it

1720
01:47:17,670 --> 01:47:23,610
actually will mean that you get
more boosts. And so you know, if

1721
01:47:23,610 --> 01:47:28,050
we if we can get more of that,
more of that help next year, I

1722
01:47:28,050 --> 01:47:32,640
think that's super exciting.
Because anything that offers an

1723
01:47:32,640 --> 01:47:36,000
alternative. It's not
necessarily the end of

1724
01:47:36,000 --> 01:47:40,410
advertising, but it's an
alternative to advertising. I

1725
01:47:40,410 --> 01:47:44,610
think that to me, is a really
good thing for the health of the

1726
01:47:44,610 --> 01:47:48,810
industry, and frankly, the
health of people as a whole. So

1727
01:47:48,840 --> 01:47:50,910
you know, super excited as to
where that might go.

1728
01:47:51,750 --> 01:47:54,840
Awesome. Well, thanks for being
on the show, man. It was just

1729
01:47:54,870 --> 01:47:57,420
it's been great working with you
for the last year and a half or

1730
01:47:57,990 --> 01:48:00,450
however long it's been at this
point. I'm I'm losing track of

1731
01:48:00,450 --> 01:48:05,040
time, but I'm good, Adam. Merry
Christmas, James. Merry

1732
01:48:05,040 --> 01:48:05,550
Christmas.

1733
01:48:06,330 --> 01:48:09,420
Indeed. And Happy Christmas to
you. And I look forward to

1734
01:48:09,720 --> 01:48:12,420
hopefully seeing you in the US
at some point next year.

1735
01:48:12,720 --> 01:48:13,710
Yeah, that would be great.

1736
01:48:13,890 --> 01:48:17,850
Thank you again, James. That'll
do it for the board meeting. The

1737
01:48:17,850 --> 01:48:21,660
pre Christmas board meeting of
podcasting. 2.01 more before the

1738
01:48:21,660 --> 01:48:24,120
end of the year. Have a very
Merry Christmas everybody. We'll

1739
01:48:24,120 --> 01:48:24,570
see you next

1740
01:48:24,570 --> 01:48:44,010
week. You have been listening to
podcasting 2.0 Visit podcast

1741
01:48:44,040 --> 01:48:49,380
index.org for more information.
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